Oliver Stone's Alexander

[themisto]

I just saw the movie yesterday and I've just finished reading everyone's posts regarding the film and I have to say I agree for the most part. As and Alexanderphile, I was very disappointed. But I don't think the film was all bad either. Gaugemela was great. The entry into Babylon was wonderful. The battle scenes in India with the elephants were great. I also enjoyed a scene where you can see the lighthouse of Alexandria on the coast-a nice cgi recreation. But unfortunately there aren't enough of these scenes to carry to movie. To my mind, so many important battles were left out. There is far too much talking which is bad enough, but this is talking that lends no real insight into character. Less is more. Before Mr. Stone attempts another historical epic,he needs to watch some David Lean, take a few lessons from his epics and find a better screenplay writer.

[beausefaless]

I'm sure just about all people in the US don't realize this is a foreign film (French, Brits, and the last, was it Spain? Were some horses came to be used, I forget) put up all the money for this film, not one penny came from the US. Stone could not get one US corp. to come aboard. Maybe Warner Bros. put up a little but it wasn't much compared to the others.




Now with that said, I agree they left out many of the combined arms warfare and battle tactics that was used by Alexander at Gaugamela; the use multiple deceptions, skirmishers, and reserves that was used for the first time in antiquity, field artillery might have been used in this battle, anyway to name a few, that were presented as Alexanders key instruments to victory, finally these instruments to success are directly related to modern military operations. And just to mention how Stone batched up the Battle of Hydaspes, but Stone was ordered to take five hours of film and squeeze it into three so I ask you, what can he do? If he would have consulted with any of us, that studies Alexander almost every day, I know he would have done better, but he didn't which was a bloody shame but that's the way it goes.





So I ask all of you who have seen this movie, "was it better than the fifty six version," I say yes, much better. The actors in this film acted their harts out and put their careers on the line for this film and personally I think they *all* did one hell of a job!





That's way Stone made this movie into a patch-quilt, to try and tell all ages of peoples Alexanders' remarkable story and with all said I think he did.






All the best to everyone






Andrew

[jan]

National Treasure which is about America is box office #1 in the USA. I was a collector of the Franklin Mint's signers of the Declaration of Independence, so this is literally two movies pertaining to me and done purposely. I wrote a book similar to the tale of National Treasure, and JOn Voigt reminds me of it in his dialogue in the movie. The two were set to come out together, and so thanks for the explanation about the financial backing. I now understand this entire plot, thanks to you.

[ruthaki]

I've already put my two-bits-worth in on another thread but I just wanted to ask you, Andrew: Did you happen to see the "Becoming Alexander" documentary? I found it fascinating the way Colin Farrell was trained for the part. Stone used American military personell, weapons people etc. And then of course the 'boot camp' in Morocco which was astounding!

[beausefaless]

I appreciate you asking me this question: Yes, it was so funny watching Farrell ride bare-back for the first time, it looked like he was ready to shake out of his shorts (vibrate). He rode saddled horses in "American Outlaws" so I'm sure he was humbled but with his good trainer he learned quickly. The discipline they all learned from their marine Capt.. along with the sword and hand to hand combat training from an expert teacher, one meal a day, and calisthenics was essential for this type of film. This is why the sixteen by sixteen phalanx troops in close array were in perfect unison. Also the main actors in the film studied hard on Alexander, they had to become familiar with the characters and from their interviews I feel they did a great job within a six week period of time. Yes I also agree the "Becoming Alexander" documentary was fascinating.I would love to see the rest of the two hours which was cut out, I believe most of that was bloody battle scenes. Maybe their pears will not feel the same about this movie as most of these so called, self proclaimed critics do. Look what happened to "Midnight Express" and "Scarface," both were laughed at by most of the critics, maybe we'll see Oliver Stone speak out, "say hello to my little friend," as he walks away with an Oscar. I know, at this point in time this looks very doubtful but you never know.This goes to show how well discipline and tremendous shape Alexander's army was in, they were ready for anything and everything (battles) that came their way. Most armies in antiquity pale compared to this one, they wrote the book on how to conquer a continent and the movie tried to show it. More thought on *logistics* would have been nice.Its amazing most people dwell in negativity every day and positive thought is easily suppressed so I'm not surprised most people get off on creating any bummer they can muster up about this film. I feel it's safe to say that you and I plus a few others conduct ourselves to the opposite with this story and why not. Best regards, Andrew

[ruthaki]

Yes, thanks for your comments, Andrew. After having read about it for years and years it was quite thrilling to see the phalanx in action and to see in the documentary how they did this. These are the details that I appreciate in the film. Also some of the reconstructions (as I've mentioned in another thread, in particular the reconstruction of the theatre at Aigai.) It makes it all so 'real' to me.

[beausefaless]

I couldn't agree more, Ruth I have a question on Aigai: Few years past I purchased a lovely two volume set called "Macedonia, The Land of a God," one part a researcher clamed, while standing in the ruins of the theater, "after the assassin Pausanias thrust his blade into Philip, due to his flee of blind panic he threw himself into a wall allowing Alexander's friends to kill him against this wall," and the common story; A young Macedonian noble, attempted to escape but tripped and was killed on the spot by few close friends of Philip's son Alexander. Was this theater enclosed or partially enclosed by a wall?I must admit I'm jealous with envy, the anticipation you and others must have felt on the way to Aigai and then walking amongst these ruins must have been grandiose. Thank you so much for your time.

[George]

As a Greek-Macedonian by decent, who's father was named
Alexander and to whom I named my only son, I was bitterly
disapointed by this movie. I took my son to this movie for
inspiration, not a long winded explanation as to what was
wrong with the film. One leaves the theatre thinking... what was so great about
Alexander? Too much meaningless dialogue, missed battles,
and a terrible portrayal of his parents. Surely, such a great
man could not have had such terrible parents? Rather than a great story retold with high drama and action,
the movie is too long and inept in its presentation. What gives with the eye liner and mascara on the men?
I am tired of the homosexual propaganda claiming that
Alexander was bisexual. Why must they always think that all
good men are gay? When truly a good man can never be gay!Save your money and don't support Mr. Stone's warped
version of his own self-belief that he truly is great!

[Thalestris]

I could not resist, I tried, but I was compelled to rebut you, George. I agreed with most of your posting, until you declared that only good men could *not* be gay. How extraordinarily prejudice of a statement, originating from genuine ignorance. All I can say about judging someone's goodness is the person's degree of compassion toward life, and you sir, surely lack compassion and understanding, the two virtues that compose a *good PERSON*. Hatred and bigotry make up a *bad* person, remember that. One's sexuality has nothing to do with goodness. ROAR!Thalestris

[Yiannis K]

Here here! You have me covered Thalestris!
I also find it utterly inacceptable to judge one's character based on his/her sexual preferences!

[Linda]

Ah well..let's hope your son doesn't turn out "bad", George. He'll have a supportive father...

You'll go to HELL, HELL!And it isn't funny - an actor in the UK has allegedly tried to commit suicide because he was being "outed". He says he isn't gay, but what a sorry mess. Maybe some troubled teen will go to Alexander, see Jared in his eyeliner, and think "what's so bad about what I feel".Linda

[marcus]

Hi Linda,Who was that, then? I'm not one for the gossip rags and tabloids, but my interest is piqued.Marcus

[jan]

I watched some of Princess Diana's secret tapes last evening which were shown on NBC. Prince Charles mentioned something about her taking him on. I cannot speak for Oliver Stone, but in the making of Alexander which was seen on Discover Channel, I saw immediately the relationship between the grizzled sergeant teaching Colin Farrell how to act a resemblance between an old friend of mine from my yesteryear teaching here in Phoenix. When I read Manfredi's book on ATG I realized then that it pertained to that time period also, so I became aware of clues in the book that pertained to my stint in Arizona. Dorothy looked like the grizzled marine and through her I met a couple of friends whose name is Manfredi. I thought of them while I read the book.The sunset scene I loved because I had recently described that scene on another channel so I was happy that it was seen on television. Had the movie been as true to all my images of Alexander that I have the privilege of learning, I would have been delighted. I have a long file of Alexander memoribilia that would make any fan of Alexander pleased and happy. He is that beautiful to me.While I was advised not to speak of this on this forum, I have taken that advice, but I have been studying for years the phenomena of mind reading, esp, and coincidences, along with the possibility of Truman Burbank style eavesdropping. So I was waiting to see if any of my images would show up in this movie. The one of Craterus which I had mentioned boldly on the Alexander-Macedon channel proved to be a good thing that I had mentioned it. That was pure psychic projection, and I am grateful to the movie for that even.Despite the jumbled effects of the movie, it has some good scenes, some nice moments, but it is not the way I see Alexander at all. He is very grave, very competent, exceedingly intelligent, and not the incompetent boob that Stone has presented to the world. I applaud the Greeks for suing, but for incompetency, not for sexuality. As everything else in the movie is a lie, so is the bit about the bisexuality! Lawyerspeak!

[jan]

I watched some of Princess Diana's secret tapes last evening which were shown on NBC. Prince Charles mentioned something about her taking him on. I cannot speak for Oliver Stone, but in the making of Alexander which was seen on Discover Channel, I saw immediately the relationship between the grizzled sergeant teaching Colin Farrell how to act a resemblance between an old friend of mine from my yesteryear teaching here in Phoenix. When I read Manfredi's book on ATG I realized then that it pertained to that time period also, so I became aware of clues in the book that pertained to my stint in Arizona. Dorothy looked like the grizzled marine and through her I met a couple of friends whose name is Manfredi. I thought of them while I read the book.The sunset scene I loved because I had recently described that scene on another channel so I was happy that it was seen on television. Had the movie been as true to all my images of Alexander that I have the privilege of learning, I would have been delighted. I have a long file of Alexander memoribilia that would make any fan of Alexander pleased and happy. He is that beautiful to me.While I was advised not to speak of this on this forum, I have taken that advice, but I have been studying for years the phenomena of mind reading, esp, and coincidences, along with the possibility of Truman Burbank style eavesdropping. So I was waiting to see if any of my images would show up in this movie. The one of Craterus which I had mentioned boldly on the Alexander-Macedon channel proved to be a good thing that I had mentioned it. That was pure psychic projection, and I am grateful to the movie for that even.Despite the jumbled effects of the movie, it has some good scenes, some nice moments, but it is not the way I see Alexander at all. He is very grave, very competent, exceedingly intelligent, and not the incompetent boob that Stone has presented to the world. I applaud the Greeks for suing, but for incompetency, not for sexuality. As everything else in the movie is a lie, so is the bit about the bisexuality! Lawyerspeak!

[me]

The guy who plays Spencer Moon in Eastenders..a tabloid invention from start to finish, perhaps, but he has left Eastenders unexpectedly, and there have been rumours in the press about his sexuality for ages and also counter stories about him seen with a woman, pretty pointless unless they are "counter" stories. He reportedly tried to kill himself recently. Who knows the truth, really.