More on The Persian Boy

[jan]

Greetings, and I have just completed the search for all that has already been said about The Persian Boy. I know many of you are fans of Mary Renault.
I have just read Sweetwater's biography of her and now understand somehow the nursing which is a part of her novel.
But I would like to know where in history there are explicit references to sexuality between the eunuch and Alexander. I hate to admit that I am completely naive about the sexlife of a eunuch.
As for Bagoas being described as the most beautiful man in the Persian empire, (and later I learned that he was supposed to have been an Egyptian eunuch, while Renault goes to lengths describing his father's death, contributing to another subplot in the story,) I find his demeanor and his subservience to be like that of a pet dog more than a most beautiful, properly haughty, and proud Chief.
Somehow Mary Renault did not convince me that her character deserved becoming the lover of such a fearless and awesome personality as Alexander when all he prompted himself to do was to remain invisible, to make haste and get out of Alexander and other's way, and to crawl in bed and occasionally throw his arms around Alexander and nestle up to him to give him warmth and comfort. He seemed to vie with the dog that lay around the bed often enough to make me suspicious that in reality, the character is a putdown of that great beauty more than anything else.
His antipathy towards Hephaestion was small and bigoted but underwent great and noble changes. I have a good friend who reminds me of Renault, and somehow I cannot find it plausible for a woman of Renault's warmth, earthiness, and attitude to be convincing in describing a Chief Eunuch. It is a bit like Carol Burnett trying to pretend that she is really Elizabeth Taylor. It just doesn't work for me.
(Once upon a time Carol was compared in the Detroit Free Press with Julie Andrews, one the crow, the other the canary or sparrow...you get the idea.)
I like parts and pieces of Persian Boy but she is just too much in love with a King who is really a savage and brutal killer of innocents and guilty alike, whether in Thebes or at Persepolis. I would have expected Bagoas to have shown more character in realizing that the carnage at Persepolis was excessive. Finally, Alexander ordered the end of killing all the women and children there, realizing that only a few were left.

[Linda]

Hmm - well, opinions about The Persian Boy vary. I like it, but I would agree that Renault is in love with Alexander, and I don't like her depiction of his character as much as in Fire from Heaven. His is very distant. Neither is totally convincing but I still rate her books more highly than anyone else I have read in this genre. And she does mostly get her facts right, even though she uses interpretation and embellishment and selectiveness. She provides notes, as you know, to correct where she may have got carried away.I think Bagoas in Renault is an appealing character who deals with his lot as a eunuch, slave and great beauty with intelligence and humility - it made me care for him. If anything, he is too perfect. A few twinges of jealousy...he is trapped by his status in life and by being in love with someone who belongs to everyone, and who, ultimately, loves someone else. He is meant to be 16 - 20 or so. And it clear that Alexander's love for him is not meant to be the same as that for Hephaestion. I am not entirely sure I believe the relationship in "real life" - probably not, but I do in the book. It is just one Alexander.As I mentioned below, I think you are getting your Bagoas's mixed up. Bagoas in Renault is the "chief" eunuch but is explicitly not political, unlike the Bagaos who made Daruis III king.Did Alexander kill people in Persopolis? I thought he just set it on fire. But I get the point. Bagaos is a character - he loves Alexander, so his first concern is for Alexander's well-being - it may not be right, but we all excuse the people we love, sometimes terrible things. Bagoas only has Alexander, who shows him respect and love, and so he becomes devoted to him. But I don't believe that the real Bagaos was as perfect as in Renault - if we believe Curtius, the real Bagaos was capable of fighting dirty when he was slighted. The Persian Boy isn't Anna Karenina, by any manner of means. The characterisation is idealised, but it is still immensely readable and affecting and more thoughtful and intelligent, and historically accurate and convicing than any other fiction about Alexander (apart from the Romance, which is quite different). I think.

[dean]

Hello,First- there was a massacre at Persepolis if I remember rightly which Parmenion and his men strongly disapproved of as they believed Alexander was destroying something that belonged to himself.I understand that the Macedonians went on a frenzy in the Persian capital- leaving only the palace for Alexander and that Alexander did nothing to stop them.Talking about the Persian boy I too would be interested to discover more about the extant sources which give more information about Alexander's sexuality as in Arrian and Plutarch there is certainly nothing there whatsoever to shed any light.The Persian Boy is .....??? It is for me very hard to describe because it had a massive impact on me. I understand that Renault does idealise her hero but then that I fall into the same trap regarding Renault, because her writing is damned good.The eunuch Bagoas is a fly on the wall in the book and not much more. He is the devoted little puppy that waits on Alexander even after death and I think that Renault used weak Bagoas as an interesting symbol to increase our view of Alexander as powerful and strong, and to always justify her own biased view of him.I have my suspicions too that Renault in the Persian boy, although apparently being rigourous in her history has projected part of her own sexual agenda into it.According to Renault when Alexander is responsible for any crime she portrays him as being misunderstood and that his motives if not his actions were at least noble which can't have always been the case.Best regards,
Dean.

[jan]

I apologize as my editing skills show in this long paragraph which originally had been broken into paragraphs. But I will learn the wiles of the computer before too long. Somehow I felt I was being punished for attacking Renault...my own personal hangups.But back to Persian Boy as I have been thinking about it a lot. Originally, she had the eunuch be specially trained by the former eunuch who was being replaced by a more beautiful specimen. I had liked the development of Bagoas as a trophy for the then King Darius, but he was simply putty in someone else's hands.As he falls in love with Alexander after having followed Darius to the end, he undergoes a strange kind of transformation in character and personality. He becomes a valet and chambermaid which is possibly historically accurate.But I wondered at why he would not be hurt or angry at the taking of his own palace. Granted, I do not know anything about the history of Bagoas at all, and that is a common name for all eunuchs in Persian history as I soon learned on the search engines.I also wondered if he hadn't performed some wonderful feat in saving Alexander, or some other remarkable event which caused the history of The famous Kiss. I can't believe it was simply a demonstration of affection as Renault has suggested.Yes, after meeting with the Greeks whose hands and feet had been severed by the Persians, Alexander had Persepolis sacked as badly as Achilles had helped to sack Troy. I suspect that all of the sackings against Thebes, Tyre, and Persepolis were rationalized as reasonable as Troy had been sacked and ruined in history. Alexander seems to believe that yesterday's history is the right model to follow for his own daring and dash.I just felt that the character of a great and proud beauty should show more concern for his own needs than he has done in this storyline. As a dancer, I imagine that he is quite graceful in his walk, that he has good posture, that he hold his head high, that he attracts attention wherever he goes. I actually like the character of Bagoas and the fact that Alexander has befriended him. I just believe that Alexander would be better served with an august and noble character rather than a weak and docile personality.To me, an actor such as Tyrone Power would have made a great Bagoas for the beauty aspect of it.And my problem with Alexander is that if he believes himself to be divine, then he should not be a debaucherer. I rather thi

[jan]

continued as I talked too long. My point to be continued is that Alexander is a kind of spiritual leader whose homage to the gods pays off for him. I
believe that he held himself to a higher standard than that of his own troops and therefore probably behaved in a manner that would be considered moral rather than depraved. At least, I hope so.