Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
Moderator: pothos moderators
Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
The latest episode of Bettany Hughes' 'Treasure of the World' concentrated on Bulgaria ie the Thracians, and it was most interesting.
I confess I have tended to regard the Thracians in the same way the Greeks seem to have regarded them - as barbarians - meaning with the modern connotation of uncivilised, and that Philip and Alexander conquered them to keep unruly and savage neighbours in check. And the gold helped as well. I was aware of the fabulous gold work from Bulgaria, but I had not come across before the gold currently in the Varna Archaeological Museum, the oldest worked gold in the world dating to 6,500 year ago. There is an article on the gold here https://www.thearchaeologist.org/blog/o ... -years-ago.
Bettany also visited the tomb of Seuthes III, who died around 300 BC. The tomb looks awfully like a small Mycenaean beehive tomb, sealed with marble doors like the Macedonian ones at Vergina. It contained an amazing head of Seuthes III, and impressive goldwork. She also visited the Kazanlak tomb, with wonderful 'original' (to quote Bettany) artwork. Both these sites can be seen here https://kazanlakmuseum.com/en/?cid=31.
Very interesting as well was a visit to a young bride whose face was painted white and sequins applied, reminiscent of this female head from Mycenae https://www.alamy.com/woman-possibly-a- ... archtype=0.
If you get a chance to watch this episode, it is the best one for quite a while. A Bulgarian woman came up to Bettany and said she had seen all her programmes so other non-UK networks are presumably showing these shows. A word of caution though about Bettany's generalisations - people didn't just come out of caves 6,500 years ago and start producing gold artifacts.
I confess I have tended to regard the Thracians in the same way the Greeks seem to have regarded them - as barbarians - meaning with the modern connotation of uncivilised, and that Philip and Alexander conquered them to keep unruly and savage neighbours in check. And the gold helped as well. I was aware of the fabulous gold work from Bulgaria, but I had not come across before the gold currently in the Varna Archaeological Museum, the oldest worked gold in the world dating to 6,500 year ago. There is an article on the gold here https://www.thearchaeologist.org/blog/o ... -years-ago.
Bettany also visited the tomb of Seuthes III, who died around 300 BC. The tomb looks awfully like a small Mycenaean beehive tomb, sealed with marble doors like the Macedonian ones at Vergina. It contained an amazing head of Seuthes III, and impressive goldwork. She also visited the Kazanlak tomb, with wonderful 'original' (to quote Bettany) artwork. Both these sites can be seen here https://kazanlakmuseum.com/en/?cid=31.
Very interesting as well was a visit to a young bride whose face was painted white and sequins applied, reminiscent of this female head from Mycenae https://www.alamy.com/woman-possibly-a- ... archtype=0.
If you get a chance to watch this episode, it is the best one for quite a while. A Bulgarian woman came up to Bettany and said she had seen all her programmes so other non-UK networks are presumably showing these shows. A word of caution though about Bettany's generalisations - people didn't just come out of caves 6,500 years ago and start producing gold artifacts.
Re: Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
Apparently tonight's episode (7 pm Channel 4) features the "birthplace of Alexander the Great" Aigai, to see artifacts that are being restored. Should be worth seeing.
Re: Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
Visually this was very interesting, although a bit misleading in places. For example, Bettany was walking through one of the large rooms off the central courtyard at Aigai, but gave the impression that it was the courtyard itself, which could house 4,000 people. There was also a large drainage channel shown, into which a bathing pool emptied. This occasioned a flight of fancy that Alexander and his teenage friends (implication being that they were being educated here) would have been bathing in the pool after exercising. Maybe, but that wasn't the principal purpose of the drain (far too big for emptying a bath) as it looked to be for diverting winter rain and snow runoff away from the palace.
A statue of Eurydike, Philip's mother, was also shown and the family resemblance with Philip and Alexander was noticeable. There was also a visit to the tomb that is generally known as Eurydike's - the one with the marble throne. However, the Greek archaeologist (I didn't catch her name unfortunately) seems to have attributed it to Thessalonike, Cassander's wife. But who would have buried her in such spectacular fashion when one of her two surviving sons was involved in her murder, and the other was possibly underage?
Anyway, we were also told that Queen Meda, Philip's sixth wife, threw herself on Philip's funeral pyre. And the evidence for this? Not given.
I may have to stop watching Bettany Hughes' programmes as I am beginning to find her socialist and feminist slant on history misleading. There are also too many sweeping statements that at the least are debatable, but I won't bother going into any of this as it is merely my personal view.
A statue of Eurydike, Philip's mother, was also shown and the family resemblance with Philip and Alexander was noticeable. There was also a visit to the tomb that is generally known as Eurydike's - the one with the marble throne. However, the Greek archaeologist (I didn't catch her name unfortunately) seems to have attributed it to Thessalonike, Cassander's wife. But who would have buried her in such spectacular fashion when one of her two surviving sons was involved in her murder, and the other was possibly underage?
Anyway, we were also told that Queen Meda, Philip's sixth wife, threw herself on Philip's funeral pyre. And the evidence for this? Not given.
I may have to stop watching Bettany Hughes' programmes as I am beginning to find her socialist and feminist slant on history misleading. There are also too many sweeping statements that at the least are debatable, but I won't bother going into any of this as it is merely my personal view.
- Jeanne Reames
- Pezhetairos (foot soldier)
- Posts: 159
- Joined: Tue Jun 02, 2015 3:44 am
- Contact:
Re: Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
I've been to Bulgaria and seen both the tombs and the Thracians goods in museums, especially Kazanlak, Plovdiv, and Sofia. Absolutely stunning stuff. And the first thing that strikes one is the parallels to what we're seeing in Macedonia, in both goods and tomb type, although tombs such as Seuthes' is after Alexander. Yes, it's sort of Mycenaean, but the connections to Macedonia are stronger, especially once you see the grave goods too. There are differences. Bodies are not buried in these tombs; they're cenotaphs, having to do with burial beliefs. The bodies were cut into 7 pieces and buried anonymously. Also, several of these tombs are "retired" shrines. Like vaulted Macedonian tombs, each is unique, even if they share obvious similarities. Anyway, as noted, there's a lot of shared culture between Eastern/Lowland Macedonia and Thrace, but in burial goods and also the prominence of deities such as Dionysos and The Rider.
Recent archaeology out of northern Greece, as well as ancient Thrace and Illyria is demonstrating that the Greek take on the "barbarism" of these people well back into the Late Iron Age (Archaic Era) is more political/philosophic fiction than reality, and later Roman Second Sophistic takes only emphasized the fiction further. This is where I love how archaeology can catch our textual evidence in an obvious lie. Ha.
Recent archaeology out of northern Greece, as well as ancient Thrace and Illyria is demonstrating that the Greek take on the "barbarism" of these people well back into the Late Iron Age (Archaic Era) is more political/philosophic fiction than reality, and later Roman Second Sophistic takes only emphasized the fiction further. This is where I love how archaeology can catch our textual evidence in an obvious lie. Ha.
----
Dr. Jeanne Reames
Director, Ancient Mediterranean Studies
Graduate Studies Chair
University of Nebraska, Omaha
287 ASH; 6001 Dodge Street
Omaha NE 68182
http://jeannereames.net/cv.html
Dr. Jeanne Reames
Director, Ancient Mediterranean Studies
Graduate Studies Chair
University of Nebraska, Omaha
287 ASH; 6001 Dodge Street
Omaha NE 68182
http://jeannereames.net/cv.html
Re: Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
A quick look around on t'Internet says that the theory that Meda slew herself came from NGL Hammond. I will do some more digging to find out where he said this, and what his source/evidence for it is.
Re: Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
Hammond put this theory forward in 'Philip of Macedon' (1994), p.182. The female occupant of Tomb II at Aegae was "equipped for war or for hunting in the afterlife", including a quiver, which Hammond takes to suggest that the woman was Thracian. Her age was c.25. He therefore could not explain why a Thracian woman of 25 could be buried with Philip (he assumes that the male in Tomb II was indeed Philip II) unless it were Meda.
Heckel thinks it implausible, because Thracian widow-suicides were by strangulation rather than cremation (re. Hdt 4.71.4).
In other words, there is no evidence that Meda threw herself on Philip's funeral pyre, merely a theory based on very shaky peripheral evidence and a number of Occam-razor-like assumptions.
![Smile :-)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
Re: Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
Yes, I was about to post exactly the same - bending the evidence to fit the theory that it was Philip II's tomb, and not Philip Arrhideus's tomb. The warlike accoutrements suit Adae/Eurydike (educated by an Illyrian mother in warlike pursuits) far more than Cleopatra/Eurydike who would be the logical wife to be buried with Philip as she died not long after him.In other words, there is no evidence that Meda threw herself on Philip's funeral pyre, merely a theory based on very shaky peripheral evidence and a number of Occam-razor-like assumptions.
The thing that bugged me though was the designation of Meda as a Queen. We have no evidence she was ever referred to as such. She was a consort, not a queen, as she does not appear to have had any children which would have elevated her status, nor does she appear to have been married to Philip long enough to have built up any power or influence at the Macedonian court - and as an outsider that would have been difficult. It is part of Bettany's creed that women are intrinsically worth more than men, and that is why she has been elevated to the status of a Queen Regnant, when she was nothing of the sort.
Re: Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
Yes, it would makes sense that culture of the whole area of the Balkans would have been fairly homogenous. Yet it may have been more limited in Thrace and Illyria than in Greece because these areas are more isolated than Greece and the islands, whose inhabitants were forced outwards by the limited land and poor soils. An earlier episode of the series came from Albania (Illyria), and there are some seriously formidable looking mountains in the interior of the country. Similarly in the episode in Bulgaria where the girl with the painted face was from, the village was very isolated, cut off for months in the winter (even in this day and age) and speaking a dialect that even their neighbours didn't understand.Recent archaeology out of northern Greece, as well as ancient Thrace and Illyria is demonstrating that the Greek take on the "barbarism" of these people well back into the Late Iron Age (Archaic Era) is more political/philosophic fiction than reality, and later Roman Second Sophistic takes only emphasized the fiction further. This is where I love how archaeology can catch our textual evidence in an obvious lie. Ha.
But, since the fall of communism, it is good that the culture of these areas is getting wider recognition, which the series has been useful for.
Re: Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
I think we should give Bettany Hughes a bit of a break - she's making popular history programmes, and for those who aren't well versed in ancient history it's easier to designate the wife of a king as a queen, even though *we* know that there were no such things as 'queens' in Macedonia. I haven't seen the programme, but I don't think that calling Meda a 'queen' automatically means that she's been elevated to 'queen regnant'.Alexias wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2024 7:46 pmYes, I was about to post exactly the same - bending the evidence to fit the theory that it was Philip II's tomb, and not Philip Arrhideus's tomb. The warlike accoutrements suit Adae/Eurydike (educated by an Illyrian mother in warlike pursuits) far more than Cleopatra/Eurydike who would be the logical wife to be buried with Philip as she died not long after him.In other words, there is no evidence that Meda threw herself on Philip's funeral pyre, merely a theory based on very shaky peripheral evidence and a number of Occam-razor-like assumptions.
The thing that bugged me though was the designation of Meda as a Queen. We have no evidence she was ever referred to as such. She was a consort, not a queen, as she does not appear to have had any children which would have elevated her status, nor does she appear to have been married to Philip long enough to have built up any power or influence at the Macedonian court - and as an outsider that would have been difficult. It is part of Bettany's creed that women are intrinsically worth more than men, and that is why she has been elevated to the status of a Queen Regnant, when she was nothing of the sort.
It's like the recent programme on 'The Lost Scrolls of Pompeii' - the scrolls were from Herculaneum, but the broadcaster changed the name to make it more appealing - people haven't heard of Herculaneum, so would be more likely to watch if it had 'Pompeii' in the title. And we've already seen how much broadcasters mash up the real history to make a programme more accessible, in the case of the Netflix Alexander programme
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
Re: Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
No, it was not a casual, accidental or generalised appellation. 'Queen' was said with a capital 'Q' in an effort to elevate the status of the female occupant of the tomb to the same status as the male occupant. Fine if it was Adea/Eurydike as she was a player, but Meda wasn't, as far as we know.Marcus:
I think we should give Bettany Hughes a bit of a break - she's making popular history programmes, and for those who aren't well versed in ancient history it's easier to designate the wife of a king as a queen, even though *we* know that there were no such things as 'queens' in Macedonia. I haven't seen the programme, but I don't think that calling Meda a 'queen' automatically means that she's been elevated to 'queen regnant'.
Bettany constantly uses these programmes to push a feminist agenda. She uses the phrase 'WOMEN, men and children' instead of the more usual 'Men, women and children'. Why she can't just say 'people' if she dislikes the latter phrase, I don't know. At Aigai, she concentrated on a statue of Eurydike, commenting on the power of the figure - never mind that the body was a bog standard one on which the head of any goddess or important woman could be placed. Also in this episode she visit Byllis, an Illyrian city now in Albania - an amazing looking place - and concentrated on some queen whose name I have forgotten, but who doesn't even warrant a mention in the Wikipedia entry for this city. Maybe she wasn't even from this city. She was also talking about a female moneylender, assuming that she was a self-made woman, and not that she might have inherited the money from someone.
I'd suggest you watch the episode on catch-up and you might see why I am getting annoyed with her. Historians should aim for a balanced neutrality, not bend history to fit their own agenda. That is a very dangerous thing to start doing if you are not aiming for objectivity. I appreciate that the aim of these programmes is to introduce lesser-known historical sites to a wider audience, but they don't need her feminist gloss. Sorry, letting off a bit of steam here.
Re: Bettany Hughes - Bulgaria
That's all fair enough - I haven't seen the programme, so was only trying to give her a break!Alexias wrote: ↑Sun May 19, 2024 3:00 pm I'd suggest you watch the episode on catch-up and you might see why I am getting annoyed with her. Historians should aim for a balanced neutrality, not bend history to fit their own agenda. That is a very dangerous thing to start doing if you are not aiming for objectivity. I appreciate that the aim of these programmes is to introduce lesser-known historical sites to a wider audience, but they don't need her feminist gloss. Sorry, letting off a bit of steam here.
![Smile :-)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
I don't think we can expect balanced neutrality in many popular history programmes; but maybe this is, as you say, her particular axe to grind. I'd never noticed this in any of her other programmes ... then again, I haven't had a TV for about 15 years, so am not up-to-date with her (or others') output.
![Smile :-)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
M