Own an original Alexander - if you're rich enough!

[amyntoros]

There are three "Alexanders" up for auction at Bonhams on April 13th - two sculpted heads and one carnelian intaglio ring. I had no idea that items such as this are still being offered for sale on the open market. Makes me wonder what else may be hidden in private collections. Dare I hope that these will be purchased by a museum so the rest of us may enjoy them?



Best regards

[Alexias]

Jaw-dropping. I am going to save the pictures at any rate!

[marcus]

There are three "Alexanders" up for auction at Bonhams on April 13th - two sculpted heads and one carnelian intaglio ring. I had no idea that items such as this are still being offered for sale on the open market. Makes me wonder what else may be hidden in private collections. Dare I hope that these will be purchased by a museum so the rest of us may enjoy them?

Blimey!

Don't have the money, but wish I did!

ATB

[derek]

What bugs me is that we know these items have all been stolen. Maybe not recently, but that’s how they came to be in private hands. Only the second item has a background they dare mention, and even then they use the euphemism aquired. It’s been going on for centuries and all over the world, artifacts continue to be stolen. I read about Mexico the other day. They have 40,000 known archaeological sites, of which only a few hundred are fully protected. The rest are wide open to the thieves.

Derek

[amyntoros]

What bugs me is that we know these items have all been stolen. Maybe not recently, but that’s how they came to be in private hands. Only the second item has a background they dare mention, and even then they use the euphemism aquired. It’s been going on for centuries and all over the world, artifacts continue to be stolen. I read about Mexico the other day. They have 40,000 known archaeological sites, of which only a few hundred are fully protected. The rest are wide open to the thieves.

Derek

The same can be said about many other places. Bulgarian archaeologists, for instance, unearth a new Thracian tomb or site on what seems like a monthly basis, yet looting is so prevalent that they must immediately remove any items found and place them in local museums. This means, or course, that artifacts cannot be studied in situ, making it more difficult to garner accurate new information about Thracian culture.

And then there's Afghanistan. Take a look at the two photographs of Ai Khanum on this site. Heartbreaking . . . just heartbreaking.

Best regards,

[Taphoi]

You don't need to be rich to own a better, much older and more assuredly authentic Alexander image than any of these from Bonhams. The silver tetradrachm coins of Lysimachus and Ptolemy (as Satrap) are your best options. They are engraved within living memory of Alexander by people who may have seen him in life or were using first generation sculptures (perhaps by Lysippus). The one below sold for about $6000 recently. It was minted in Lampsakos in Asia Minor in about 290BC and is in excellent style and condition. It is a Thompson 49'er, with the Delta-Xi monogram and crescent in the exergue on the reverse - absolute top of the range! At no extra cost you get the ram's horns of Ammon and the diadem plus no doubt whatsoever that it is Alexander and a nice image of Athena bearing Nike on the reverse - probably celebrating Lysimachus's victory at Ipsus by crowning his name. Why does anyone pay so much more for bad Roman imitations?
Best wishes,
Andrew

Thompson49.jpg (43.5 KiB) Viewed 12740 times

[marcus]

You don't need to be rich to own a better, much older and more assuredly authentic Alexander image than any of these from Bonhams. The silver tetradrachm coins of Lysimachus and Ptolemy (as Satrap) are your best options. They are engraved within living memory of Alexander by people who may have seen him in life or were using first generation sculptures (perhaps by Lysippus). The one below sold for about $6000 recently. It was minted in Lampsakos in Asia Minor in about 290BC and is in excellent style and condition. It is a Thompson 49'er, with the Delta-Xi monogram and crescent in the exergue on the reverse - absolute top of the range! At no extra cost you get the ram's horns of Ammon and the diadem plus no doubt whatsoever that it is Alexander and a nice image of Athena bearing Nike on the reverse - probably celebrating Lysimachus's victory at Ipsus by crowning his name. Why does anyone pay so much more for bad Roman imitations?
Best wishes,
Andrew

Thompson49.jpg

Ha, Andrew. Glad to know that you are not affected by the current economic climate. I would have to be considerably better off than I am at the moment to be able to shell out $6,000 on anything!

Still, one can get Lysimachus coins of Alexander for considerably less than $6,000. They might not be in as good condition, but they're available. I have one myself.

But you are basically correct, I suppose, in suggesting that one can buy earlier, more "authentic" mementoes than those Roman copies, for considerably less cost.

ATB

[amyntoros]

But you are basically correct, I suppose, in suggesting that one can buy earlier, more "authentic" mementoes than those Roman copies, for considerably less cost.

It's all a matter of preference, don't you think? Some people collect coins and some people prefer artwork which can be displayed. I also own an Alexander coin, although one costing much less than $6,000. I do, however, derive more daily enjoyment from the etchings on my wall and the copies of ancient sculptures on my shelves. And when I visit a museum or an exhibit I confess it's the statues and similar artifacts which enthrall me rather than the coins which I tend to give only a cursory glance. If I had the choice (and the money!) I'd rather purchase a Roman bust than an earlier coin, although I agree with Derek's concern about looting. However, there are plenty of coins on the market without provenance either - in fact I think they are a dream find for looters everywhere.

Best regards,

[marcus]

Some people collect coins and some people prefer artwork which can be displayed. I also own an Alexander coin, although one costing much less than $6,000. I do, however, derive more daily enjoyment from the etchings on my wall and the copies of ancient sculptures on my shelves. And when I visit a museum or an exhibit I confess it's the statues and similar artifacts which enthrall me rather than the coins which I tend to give only a cursory glance. If I had the choice (and the money!) I'd rather purchase a Roman bust than an earlier coin, although I agree with Derek's concern about looting.

That is all true. Personally, of course, I'd like to have any and all! Some things, however, cannot have any value by being replicated - I also have a 4th century BC Greek arrowhead, which while of relatively little intrinsic value (cost me about £30, if I remember) is of immense personal value. But a replica of such an item would be of no interest to me. On the other hand, I would be more than happy to have a modern replica of the Pergamon Bust on my shelf, whether it cost £10 or £1,000.

ATB

[jan]

I would imagine that Oliver Stone, or Colin Farrell, if truly fans of Alexander, could well afford to purchase any of these. Donald Trump would or could if he wanted to add to his collection of artifacts, coins, or whatever. Personally, I collected Franklin Mint coins years ago and ended up selling them, and don't want to ever be bothered with collectibles again. It all becomes a pain in the neck after a while. I always liked Alexander best when he made his followers burn their baggage when leaving Persepolis. That probably angered Philotas and Parmenio who wanted him to settle down, but I admired his guts and recognition of what is important in life. I became a real fan of Alexander when I read that...Keep the burden light, stay free, and control the forces around you...don't let them control you. Alexander is another free spirit!

[amyntoros]

... I always liked Alexander best when he made his followers burn their baggage when leaving Persepolis. That probably angered Philotas and Parmenio who wanted him to settle down, but I admired his guts and recognition of what is important in life. I became a real fan of Alexander when I read that...Keep the burden light, stay free, and control the forces around you...don't let them control you. Alexander is another free spirit!

Not when leaving Persepolis - the army had only just acquired most of their spoils - but before entering India. And it wouldn't have angered either Philotas or Parmenio because both of them were dead by then!

Best regards,

[AndrewCampbell]

It is true that it is kind of disturbing to know what else is there in lock-up depriving us of its viewing pleasure. There are many antiques out there for sure but if we do not have the money then only photos serve as our only source of enjoyment.

[Matthew Amt]

It is true that it is kind of disturbing to know what else is there in lock-up depriving us of its viewing pleasure. There are many antiques out there for sure but if we do not have the money then only photos serve as our only source of enjoyment.

As I understand it, a good 90 percent of all antiquities are in private hands. Of the 10 percent that museums hold, 90 percent of that is in storage and may never be seen by the public. Most of that is not published, heck some of it isn't even cataloged. And the museums don't have any storage space to spare...

Antiquities catalogs are a great way to see a LOT more stuff than any museum has that I can reach. In fact catalogs like Hermann Historica and the Axel Guttmann collection even had information like dimensions and WEIGHTS of helmets and other artifacts, data that museums almost never mention.

And not *all* the stuff in private or public hands was looted, some of it was dug up or exported legally. Or at least quasi-legally ("They didn't say we CAN'T!"), though most of the places that used to allow it now forbid it. Don't get me wrong, looting is horrific and incredibly destructive! But flatly banning the ownership of antiquities doesn't help, it only makes it certain that we'll never see any of it.

I don't have a good solution to offer, I'm afraid! Frankly, I like old stuff, and would love to have the money to buy a few pieces more substantial than the few coins and broken bits of jewelry that I have.

Matthew

[AndrewCampbell]

Hey Matthew, I fully agree with you and I wish I had more than enough money too to have my own stash of antiques to be put up for display at home for anyone and everyone to enjoy and admire. Nevertheless, we know that is nearly beyond possible so let us just hope the World Wide Web could support us in uncovering more antiquities to feed our admiration.