Monotheism and Alexander

dean · Post by **dean** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 7:01 pm

Hello,

While looking up a passage in Plutarch, I came across the following.

Among the sayings of one Psammon, a philosopher, whom he heard in Egypt, he most approved of this, that all men are governed by God, because in everything, that which is chief and commands is divine. But what he pronounced himself upon this subject was even more like a philosopher, for he said God was the common father of us all, but more particularly of the best of us

I do realise that Plutarch isn't the most trustworthy chronicler on all matters- but the above does make me ask a few questions.
1- Neither the Egyptians nor the Greeks were monotheists so therefore why are we speaking here in singular terms?

2- Was Zeus akin to God in the Christian sense- looking at this fragment?

3- Alexander's "quote" that God is the common father of us all but that he favours some more than others seems to suggest that there is a little bit of humour in him after all- but the quote is vaguely similar to Jesus, - he doesn't claim for himself any more or less than the rest (but recognises that he is a bit more special in that he is the son of God

)

It is funny how going back over a source can produce such thought provoking moments.

On the other hand maybe this is yet another reason why we can always take Plutarch with a pinch of salt on most occasions.

Best regards,
Dean

Efstathios · Post by **Efstathios** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 9:32 pm

Well Dean, the ancient Greek religion is maybe one of the most complicated religions.Because although the gods were the same throughout Greece ,the worship was slightly different from place to place.Generally Zeus was considered the ultimate god.The one god.The others were lesser gods.That monotheistic approach became more apparent after the influence of Socrates and other philisophers,but it was also into the Orphic texts, and the Eleusina's mysteries.

The Egyptians themselves had the teachings of Ermis (Hermes) Trismegistos, who talked about the one God, and the triad nature.It is rather vague if Ermis Trismegistos was of Greek or Egyptian Origin. According to Egyptian chronology, that with how many Pharaoes ago, he lived at around 9.000 bc. Diodorus the Sicilian refers to Ermis Trismegitos. So in a way the Egyptians had monotheism in their teachings too.There a a lot of things that we dont know about the Egyptian gods and their worship and the Greek ones.For example we dont know the secret teachings of the Eleusina's mysteries.

However, in Alexander's time the essence of one universal God was there, for the Greeks it was Zeus, plus the fact that Alexander was accepting and respected the ideology of other religions, and that's why he speaks in singular terms.

agesilaos · Post by **agesilaos** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 10:26 am

There is another explanation too Plutarch' s translator has rendered Dios as God, whilst it is the nominative of Zeus, this was a common English usage; Theos is the word we would render as God.

Efstathios · Post by **Efstathios** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 2:19 pm

Dean can you tell me in which book it is so i can look it up in Greek?

dean · Post by **dean** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 4:36 pm

Hello,

Yes of course, it is 27.10.

My first impression was that the translation was not quite on cue. The whole passage in Plutarch is so reminiscent of the Christian view- we are all sons of God which is why it stood out so much for me. This idea of everybody being a son of god is certainly not in keeping with the general idea in ancient Greece.Important people always tried to trace their lineage back to some god. So it is, to me, quite out of place that in Plutarch we find Alexander saying that we all have a common father.

But the idea of Zeus being God- when we change the common noun into a proper Noun and spell it with a capital letter must have come from the Greek idea of Zeus-. Come to think of it, in my imagination God and Zeus look the same.

Best regards,
Dean

agesilaos · Post by **agesilaos** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 11:00 am

They may look the same but Zeus has more joy with the ladies... and the boys

Zeus and theos are not the same word differetiated by capitalisation by the way but different words; initially Greek was all in capitals so that would lead to confusion.

dean · Post by **dean** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:39 pm

Hello,

They may look the same but Zeus has more joy with the ladies... and the boys

Well, looking at it from that angle, yes I guess you are right- Zeus did get about a bit and have more "joy", if you know what I mean, nudge nudge, wink wink

Best regards,
Dean