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Sincere regards.Although I am British, my parents are from Pakistan. On a visit there last year I went to the Northern tribal regions, around the Hindu Kush mountain range. I visited a small enclave in the Kafiristan region where the famous Kalash tribe live. Since their discovery in (I belive) the 18th century, they have been the subject of popular debate as to their origin. My own discussion with the town 'chief' turned out to be very interesting. He adamantly stated that He himself was a direct descendent of Alexander the Great, and that the community at large were descended from Greek soldiers who were posted to a garrison in that region. Upon my suggestion othewise he became almost violent, and unfortunately I had to leave. His son later showed my coins depicting Alexander - the ones with elepahnt hide. I tried to purchase them, but even in pounds sterling there was no price he would accept - maybe a virtue of their inmportance. I later discovered that they believed that their gods resided on the 'white mountain' and that is where their afterlife would be. They also worshipped a wine god - later I found that he had been linked to Dionysis. The reason I bring this story up now is that the other day on UK TV, Michael Palin visited the Kalash tribe, and it recalled some memories I had. I wonder if there is any truth in this story. I know Mr. Lendering has visited Pakistan, and wonder if you had any experiences with this curious yet wonderful tribe.yassar

Excuse my spelling errors in the last post. The 'white mountain' - could that be a reference to a similar belief held about Mount Olympus? If so, there is no other way that Greek influence of this extent could have extended to this region apart from Alexander the Great

I've got a map from 1838 showing a mountainous region in Budakhshan as being inhabited by people said to be descended from the Macedonians. It's on the river Koksah, north-east of Kunduz, in what the map describes as Sogdiana. Is this the same area that you're describing ?Susan

Hi Ms HolmsNo, unfortunately. The area you refer to is in modern day Uzbekistan, much north of this site. The Kafiristan region is close to the modern day pakistani city of Chitral, just south of the Khyber Pass. Coming from the west, the only way to pass the Himalayas/Hindu Khush is to use the Khyber Pass - a series of valleys and gorges. Alexander is known to have passed through to reach mainland Pakistan i think in 326. He came from the northwest, and this is the only way he could have crossed into mainland Pakistan coming from that direction. So historically he did pass the area in question. I have not been able to verify whether he did leave a garrisson in this region, although the area is fertile and produces good yields of crop and is renowned for its horses, so it may have been of some capital value.Incidentally, the hore breeders of this region also claim their horses are descended from Bucephalus, although I have also heard the same of Mongolian horse rearers.thanks, yassar

YasserI saw the programme as well, and noticed a couple of things, besides the fact that the Kalash people were astonishingly beautiful - those eyes - both the pale green or brown. More beautiful as a rule, dare I say, than present day Europeans. Also, the captain of one of the polo teams Palin met was called Iskander, and also, I think, the other captain had a horse called Bucephalus. Did I hear correctly?I like the idea of the white mountain being Olympus. Was it Alexander himself who passed that way, or was it the army of Perdiccas and (sorry Marcus) and Hephaestion?Linda

"I know Mr. Lendering has visited Pakistan, and wonder if you had any experiences with this curious yet wonderful tribe."I have not been in that area. Michael Wood has visited it and believes that there is an Alexander-link; so does Lane Fox.Jona

... There is only one mount with name WHITE ie. BEl + Ister=islka= Shining, in Makedonia, and that is Mt. PELISTER/BEL+ISTER, above the Heraclea Lincestis, LYNX, Monaster, i.e. today Bitola, from where Pilip II and therefore Alexander has its origins... So this is not just idea but pure fact, like the pictures of the young children from Kalashi people, with blue eyes, skin etc., which is in no way mediteranian- ....caracteristic...(By the way O-LIMP means M-OLIM= PRAYING, place were Macedonians use to pray to Gods...)...The Light 7000

There're also the "White Mountains" (Leuka Ori) in Crete.
Plus a couple other thounsands mountains called "white" all over the world I guess

Hi...yes maybe, but not in Makedonia and not with the name PEl-ister=BEL-ister, like PELA=BELA/P=B, so if you are talking Makedonia and Makedonians you should consider their lamguage, culture, traditions, this includes eathing/drinking habbits etc..., just to be close to Makedonians, not Hellens. In this context, even proved that today g
"Greeks" has DNA caracteristics from Ethiopia,and with the fact that Hellens are mix of subsaharian, etc. i.e. and/- Mediteranian people, than how is possible these to be able to live high in the mountains for thousands of years..., absurd, because they can not tolerate climite, you need mountain people to put on the mountains who are wine drinkers, with tradition of that kind of life style, because than there was no internet orders... for pizza, etc, so people were eathing meat, drinking red wine, ...planting ..., they were not those who are eating oysters ..., that way they could live only few months, simple as beans...The Light 7000

To be fair, no. They may have some similarities and they may have some connection with Alexander. Don't forget though that even if they are descendants of Alexander's soldiers they have developed for 2,5 millenia away from the main body of Hellenism and more in contact with surrounding civilisations. They are unique. They are Kalash.-+ Some Kalash words may have been derived from Greek. Most I read however resemble more local dialects (see 2). Tribes similar to the Kalash had been recorded there before the time of Alexander. The most probable explanation is that the Kalash are descendants of people who arrived there in on of the first migratory waves, before the Persian and Indian Indo-European migrations. As such they would have had more in common with the Macedonians than the people around them to begin with. -+ That and the geographical and strategic features of their location would have enticed Alexander to use them as support for a possible garrison. Hence Macedonian customs would have been incorporated.-+ It should be noted that we couldnGÇÖt make much of the similarities in religion, since Greeks were famous religious suncretists for one, and also many pagan rituals are similar to each other anyway. Finally gods of wine (as well as war, love etc) are probably as old as mankind itself. Traces of wine cultivation have been recently found in the Black Sea, dating some 23.000 years into the past. Air-conditioning is one thing, but you canGÇÖt expect people to live without a bit of wine!1. Greek
Their dresses bear some similarity.
http://www.creternity.com/article.phtml ... =1&catID=3
http://www.myrtos.org/lalo2.html2. Extensive
This man has lived among them for some time. Almost married one apparently!
http://www.ishipress.com/kalasha.htm3. Everyone claims them! (Slavic Macedonian Nationalists soon to follow!)
http://www.abc.net.au/foreign/stories/s904069.htm

Hi...
Thanks for info. for general public, so one can see that there is absolutelly no connection between these people and so called "Greeks" of today..., except many millions of dollars put in propaganda machinery just to put term "Greek/Greece..." evrywhere, even if it is paradox and absurd...WHY!...We can notice that you have some objective aproach towards the topic, but to be objective to yourself, you must find answer of one simple question that you are bringing in previous post re: nation states. So, how is possible that you can find neme/term Greece..., in the Bible, when Greece was established arround 1830 with the help of Duches,...and this name was unknown until than,(but you can not find name FYROM or Yugoslavia ...), and further more how is possible one to talk about it even reffering more than 2000 years ago... Nonsense,
so in that context, how one can tell other what is Greek or what is not, when we know that today Greece is simply sort of federation between Makedonia-Aegean Makedonia (by the way in Makedonian tradition Aegean see is known as WHITE SEA...and Kalash-Kalesh menas person who is not black but more like blond...), and Hellas, sth.of Mt. Olimp, and in fact today Greek nation is mix of Makedonians, Vlachs, Albanians, Turks, than Ponthos/Prosfigos..., all of them that Greece is not recognising (same was with Albania until recently when EU made "investigation" with official statment that 1/3 of Albania is multiethnic...)... Further more, you should go and to find by yourself somthing about custums, names, traditions, yes clothes, material of same etc., so you can be more objective. Evrything what you are saying is aplaying only to Makedonians and probably Vlachs,VlachoIlirians, no more no less. (No one can live near sea in such clothes and materials, and colours are pure Makedonian..., no one can drink red wine under the mediteranian sun and eat meat...., that is why Islam is forbiding eating pork and drinking alchohol- wine, because this religion is comming from the desert like region..., that is why they are covering them self, among other things which is not part of this topic...)... ...So ELA / COME to Makedonia and be part of great Makedonian nation as equal, recognised as such... ...If you go further, you should learn more about many of this topics, but than you will rise serious question about how fragile is theory about Greekness, simular to once Yugoslavia.... Be proud what you are and let others to be what the

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ELA / COME to Makedonia and be part of great Makedonian nation as equal... If you go further, you should learn more about many of this topics, but than you will rise serious queation about how fragile is theory about Greekness, simular to once Yugoslavia.... Be proud what you are and let others to be what they are, noone can tell other what he is and what he spouse to be, not any more...(Link about S
"Slavic Nationalism" is not working so no comment, but you should know that this term is overdue, becouse it was connected with Yugoslavia and Communism, there is no such a thing any more, only in yours or somone else immagiantion, ha ha ha...),...Your comment about 25000 Black Sea hystory, you are right (by the way Makedonians are calling this Crno More- Black Sea, Aegean White Sea and Adriatic Blue Sea...), and there is most important thing about some topics and hystorical data that are emerging, connection with Makedonian Tumbas, from today R. of Makedonia, therefore connection between East and West, long time before Iliad (not Triyad), when Persey and Makedon were the rulers of East and West in United World, the world that Alexander was re-uniting, Makedonian Dream... Also there is important issue here about name, spetially Zeus, so it was IOS i.e. YOS-I, different pronaunciation, that means "I" in Makedonian.... Also very important thing is date and religious meaning of this i.e. 6-th of Augus. Makedonians are celebrationg 2-nd of August as National Day, and this is St. Eliya (St.Ilija/Iliya day). The battle at Cheronea was on this day, as well 1903 Makedonian uprising and also 1940 Makedonian uprising, and everything else is connected with this, as Makedonian tredition. Now, this is very important because Homer was writing about Iliad, and the city was ILION, in the tradiotion of Makedonian God of Sun-IOS=ZIOUS=ZIOUS=DIUS+DEUS i.e IOS=ILIOS+ILION=ILIN+DEN=Makedonian traditional day-2-nd of August. So the city was Ilion,because Makedonians were builders of Ilions like Alexander of Alexandrias etc. This war was not just epic story, but it was crutual for geostrategic purposes, i.e. bridge between East and West, bettle for somthing else that others will start to explore. What was important here was connection with IOS and 2-nd of August and Ilion i.e. Ilia, and simbolism- day of transfiguration... Makedonians are celebrating this day for millenia, and even today as Ortodox Christians. We know that St.Ilija/Eliyah, was long before Christ, so i

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Also very important thing is date and religious meaning of this i.e. 6-th of Augus. Makedonians are celebrationg 2-nd of August as National Day, and this is St. Eliya (St.Ilija/Iliya day). The battle at Cheronea was on this day, as well 1903 Makedonian uprising and also 1940 Makedonian uprising, and everything else is connected with this, as Makedonian tredition. Now, this is very important because Homer was writing about Iliad, and the city was ILION, in the tradiotion of Makedonian God of Sun-IOS=ZIOUS=ZIOUS=DIUS+DEUS i.e IOS=ILIOS+ILION=ILIN+DEN=Makedonian traditional day-2-nd of August. So the city was Ilion,because Makedonians were builders of Ilions like Alexander of Alexandrias etc. This war was not just epic story, but it was crutual for geostrategic purposes, i.e. bridge between East and West, bettle for somthing else that others will start to explore. What was important here was connection with IOS and 2-nd of August and Ilion i.e. Ilia, and simbolism- day of transfiguration... Makedonians are celebrating this day for millenia, and even today as Ortodox Christians. We know that St.Ilija/Eliyah, was long before Christ, so it comes that there is no connection, but we are celebrationg this day for millenia, now it comes that somone else is doing that almost identicly with Makedonians even without knowing that. Most important thing is that Christianity is not recognaising re-incarnation officially, but incarnation... However, there is belief that when Isus/Jesus was asked where is St. Ilija/Eliyah, He was showing to St. John The Baptist, so it is like reincarnation or/and tansfiguration, one will say... Very interesting, ... in other words other people unwillingly are bringing the truth and reality about Makedonian nation, and thanks for that, you have safe us lot of time and energy, and money too, because we do not have all this for propaganda, so this is God's way to "reward" mankind towards Universal Brotherhood of Man- Makedonian Dream...There is more to say but at this stage I think is enough... Thanks ...With respect The Light 7000