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Hello All, Like Fiona, I have enjoyed this discussion...I recall an author of some renown, and sorry, can't give the name now as I am writing from long ago memory and I know that most of you will be able to know this story, that the important thing is that while Alexander would never disclose any of the information given to him to anyone at all, he began to wear the ram's horns on his head from this point on, signifying that he is son of Zeus. Just had to chime in at this point...

jan wrote:Hello All, Like Fiona, I have enjoyed this discussion...I recall an author of some renown, and sorry, can't give the name now as I am writing from long ago memory and I know that most of you will be able to know this story, that the important thing is that while Alexander would never disclose any of the information given to him to anyone at all, he began to wear the ram's horns on his head from this point on, signifying that he is son of Zeus. Just had to chime in at this point...

There's no historical evidence for Alexander actually wearing rams horns, Jan. You mentioned it also earlier this year and I made a longer response then. See the posts here

Best regards,

Hello,

just finished reading "The Venetian Betrayal", Steve Berry and thought I might tag my post on the end of this thread.

The book has "shades of the Da'Vinci Code" according to the reviews and anyway, in the acknowledgements it attributes the idea of St Mark's tomb being Alexander's final resting place to yourself Andrew.

I haven't read your book yet about the Lost Tomb of Alexander and yet this book has wet my appetite.

Well, the novel was pretty good and the last few chapters were excellent. Didn't learn anything new about Alexander but well, had never seen any pictures of the Elephant medallions which the book centres on quite a bit- the book insists on there being 8 genuine coins still around and also of course there is a discussion about what was done with Alexander's body immediately after his death.

The "baddie" in the book lives in Samarkand, and believes herself to be a descendent of the Greeks thanks to Alexanders conquests. (think I remember reading somewhere that in Samarkand there was a considerable Greek population although must read up on it again)

There is also a barbaric game still played up to present day, called BuzKashi, across central Asia mentioned which seems like polo. That was new to me.

Anyway, if anyone wants a bit of escapism reading "The Venetian Betrayal" by Steve Berry is good, although it will probably teach you very little about Alexander,

Regards,
Dean

dean wrote:There is also a barbaric game still played up to present day, called BuzKashi, across central Asia mentioned which seems like polo. That was new to me.

Polo is based on buzkashi actually. The idea pillaged when British officers came across it in Afghanistan during that other barbaric sport - 'The Great Game'.

Semiramis wrote:

dean wrote:There is also a barbaric game still played up to present day, called BuzKashi, across central Asia mentioned which seems like polo. That was new to me.

Polo is based on buzkashi actually. The idea pillaged when British officers came across it in Afghanistan during that other barbaric sport - 'The Great Game'.

That's not strictly true, I'm afraid. Polo was being played by the Persians in the 16th century - the maidan in Isfahan, when constructed by Shah Abbas, was built with polo in mind, and the stumps of the goal posts can still be seen there.

That's not to say that polo did not grow out of buzkashi; in fact, I'm sure it did ... but it wasn't invented by the British, and certainly not as late as the 19th century.

ATB

Hi,

just out of curiosity I had a quickglance on wiki. It says that it was first played as early as 6th century BC.

In medieval times, polo was a favorite sport of the Ayyubid and Mameluke dynasties of Egypt and the Levant. Notable sultans such as Saladin and Baybars were known to play it and encourage it in their court.[6]. Polo sticks were features on the Mameluke precursor to modern day playing cards.

Later on Polo was passed from Persia to other parts of Asia including the Indian subcontinent[7] and China, where it was very popular during the Tang Dynasty and frequently depicted in paintings and statues. Valuable for training cavalry, the game was played from Constantinople to Japan by the Middle Ages. Known in the East as the Game of Kings.[4] The name polo is said to have been derived from the Tibetan word "pulu", meaning ball.[8]

The article on wikipedia is excellent.

Best regards,
Dean.

Here's a nice video on Youtube of Afghan Buzkashi

Is it my imagination (hard to tell for sure without side-by-side comparison) but aren't these horses close in size to those of ancient times?

Best regards,

amyntoros wrote:Here's a nice video on Youtube of Afghan Buzkashi

Is it my imagination (hard to tell for sure without side-by-side comparison) but aren't these horses close in size to those of ancient times?

And fantastic it is, too!

Of course, there is the famous game of buzkashi in The Man who Would be King, where they use the head of the defeated chieftain (or is that polo they play, using mallets?).

ATB

marcus wrote:
Of course, there is the famous game of buzkashi in The Man who Would be King, where they use the head of the defeated chieftain (or is that polo they play, using mallets?).

ATB

You know, I thought I remembered a scene in The Man Who Would be King where they played the game using the head of an enemy! Wasn't sure though whether I had the right movie, or, as you said, whether it was actually buzkashi that they were playing. I'd pull the movie off my shelf and fast-forward through it, but unfortunately I bought it a long time ago and because it's a VHS tape and not a DVD it would take more time than I have to spare right now. Maybe someone else recalls?

Best regards,

dean wrote:just finished reading "The Venetian Betrayal", Steve Berry and thought I might tag my post on the end of this thread.

The book has "shades of the Da'Vinci Code" according to the reviews and anyway, in the acknowledgements it attributes the idea of St Mark's tomb being Alexander's final resting place to yourself Andrew.

I haven't read your book yet about the Lost Tomb of Alexander and yet this book has whetted my appetite.

Hi Dean,

I was in contact with Steve Berry early last year a little after The Venetian Betrayal was published. He is well read on the subject of Alexander and he based his plot on Frank Holt's book as far as the Elephant Medallions are concerned. It was nice of him to acknowledge both of us as his inspirations in the long note at the end of his book. I think it is a good tactic to give fictional plots a bit of zest from real research. After all, truth is sometimes even stranger than fiction. I have no problem with his books being compared to the Da Vinci Code in that he makes no pretense that the work as a whole is other than fictional.

Best wishes,

Andrew

amyntoros wrote:

marcus wrote:
Of course, there is the famous game of buzkashi in The Man who Would be King, where they use the head of the defeated chieftain (or is that polo they play, using mallets?).

ATB

You know, I thought I remembered a scene in The Man Who Would be King where they played the game using the head of an enemy! Wasn't sure though whether I had the right movie, or, as you said, whether it was actually buzkashi that they were playing. I'd pull the movie off my shelf and fast-forward through it, but unfortunately I bought it a long time ago and because it's a VHS tape and not a DVD it would take more time than I have to spare right now. Maybe someone else recalls?

Thinking about it, I'm pretty sure they're playing polo with it, because I'm sure they hit the head with mallets. I have it on DVD, but only one that I copied from a VHS, so it isn't divided into chapters. So it would take me too long to find the spot, as well.

ATB

marcus wrote:

Semiramis wrote:

dean wrote:There is also a barbaric game still played up to present day, called BuzKashi, across central Asia mentioned which seems like polo. That was new to me.

Polo is based on buzkashi actually. The idea pillaged when British officers came across it in Afghanistan during that other barbaric sport - 'The Great Game'.

That's not strictly true, I'm afraid. Polo was being played by the Persians in the 16th century - the maidan in Isfahan, when constructed by Shah Abbas, was built with polo in mind, and the stumps of the goal posts can still be seen there.

That's not to say that polo did not grow out of buzkashi; in fact, I'm sure it did ... but it wasn't invented by the British, and certainly not as late as the 19th century.

ATB

Thank you Marcus, Dean and Amyntoros. I had no idea the game was so old and widespread! I was going to give those barbaric Afghans credit for inventing it. I heard Polo and the mind immediately went to British royals. How awful to have one's ethnocentrism so exposed. I'm holding off watching the video till after work, as it may not suit all my colleagues' tastes...

Hello,

I have just seen the video on Youtube and thought that it was really good.
I bet that the sport must help the participants develop some really strong riding skills.
They seem to take the sport really seriously.

Best regards,
Dean

POSSIBLE SPOILERS !! for Venetian Betrayal

Hi Dean, I agree, this was an exciting read, a real page-turner. I tell you what, though, when they got to that cave place in the mountains, near the end, I was nearly shouting, 'Stop fighting, for goodness sake! Just look at all this stuff!'
I bet you were, too. What wouldn't we give for just one of those treasures?
Fiona

dean wrote: Well, the novel was pretty good and the last few chapters were excellent. Didn't learn anything new about Alexander but well, had never seen any pictures of the Elephant medallions which the book centres on quite a bit- the book insists on there being 8 genuine coins still around and also of course there is a discussion about what was done with Alexander's body immediately after his death.

Hi Dean, I agree, this was an exciting read, a real page-turner. I tell you what, though, when they got to that cave place in the mountains, near the end, I was nearly shouting, 'Stop fighting, for goodness sake! Just look at all this stuff!'
I bet you were, too. What wouldn't we give for just one of those treasures?
Fiona

Hi Fiona,

yes, have to admit that the last few chapters came fast and furious but like you say, if there hadn't have been so many bullets flying over everybody's head they could have had a field day with all the artefacts supposedly lying around.

Thought that the author's use of "greek fire" in the plot was pretty good too.

best regards,
~Dean.