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Re: Alexanders Greek Additions?

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:42 pm
by Efstathios
Bob in which Arrian's quote are you reffering to?I searched through your posts and didnt find it.Can you mention which extract do you mean?And i will happily comment it.

As for the other quotes that you gaves us i have replied for some.About the calendar:There are 2 months identical with the Spartan calendar so we can assume that these 2 calendars have same origin, a dorian one maybe.About the Philotas incident decribed by Kurtius,the french publisher of Kurtius' works himself speculated that this passage may have been a rhetorical effort by Kurtius.(Kurtius gave more basis in rhetoric than to present facts as they happened,and thats why there are many errors in his work,if we contemplate it with the other sources). About the incident with Alexander calling the guards with the prase "aneboa Makedonisti" : This word is used by Plutarch but not by Arrian.And they both describe the same incident.Arrian uses the phrase "Alejandros de eboa anakalvn toys ypaspistas".So either the word Makedonisti was added later in Plutarch's work,or Plutarch meant something else, like that Alexander may have used a specific phrase to call his guards.But the most important fact here is that after this Alexander talked to his ypaspistas in attic.So it would be aukward to call them in the Macedonian language but then speak to them in attic. And something else to consider:If the Macedonians were considered a barbarians,Aristotle wouldnt have gone up there to teach Alexander (and we know what Aristotle thought of barbarians) neither many comedy and drama writers would go there to present their plays.But many famous greeks including Aristotle himself and Euripedes were of Macedonian origin.So how could the southern greeks consider them as barbarians?They didnt.

Re: Alexanders Greek Additions?

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 3:06 am
by kokino kolo
the acceptance of Alexander I by the hellanodikai as a competitor in the Olympic games (probably those of 496 BC), in which, as we know, only Greeks were allowed to participate. All the inscriptions on monuments, coins and other artifacts in Macedonia and also in Pakistan, India and Iran have the Greek language on them. There are no ancient monuments with a different language.http://www.behindthename.com/php/search ... ator=orGÇó Macedonians had the same language, as all other Greeks
GÇó Macedonians had the same religion, as all other Greeks
GÇó Macedonians used the same architecture, as all other Greeks
GÇó Macedonians served the same arts, as all other Greeks
GÇó Macedonians used the same names, as all other Greeks
GÇó Macedonians had the same traditions, as all other Greeks
GÇó Macedonians had the same myths, as all other Greeks
GÇó Macedonians had the same heroes, as all other Greeks
GÇó Macedonians had the same rituals, as all other Greeks
GÇó Macedonians had the same customs, as all other Greeks
GÇó Macedonians were Greeks.
Macedonians, who participated in the Olympics at Olympia, were as follows:GÇó King Alexander I, in the 80th Olympics, in 460 BCE. He run the GÇ£StadionGÇ¥ and was placed very close second.GÇó King Arhelaos Perdikas, competed in the 93rd Olympics, in 408 BCE and won at Delphi the race of the four-horse chariot.GÇó King Philip II was an Olympic champion three times. In the 106th Olympics, in 356 BCE, he won the race, riding his horse. In the 107th Olympics, in 352 BCE, he won the four-horse chariot race. In the 108th Olympics, in 348 BCE, he was the winner of the two colt chariot.GÇó Cliton run the Stadion in the 113rd Olympics, in 328 BCE.GÇó Damasias from Amphipolis won in the Stadion in the 115th Olympics, in 320 BCE.GÇó Lampos from Philippi, was proclaimed a winner in the four-horse chariot race in the 119th Olympics, in 304 BCE. GÇó Antigonos won in the Stadion race, in the 122nd Olympics, in 292 BCE and in the 123rd Olympics in 288 BCE.GÇó Seleucos won in the field-sports competition in the 128th Olympics in 268 BCE.GÇó During the 128th Olympics, in 268 BCE and in the 129th Olympics, in 264 BCE, a woman from Macedonia won the competition. Pausanias mentions that: GÇ£GǪit is said that the race of the two-colt chariot was won by a woman, named Velestihi from the seashores of MacedoniaGÇ¥.only Greeks allowed in to compete in the Olympics. simple

Demosthenes was a Barbarian himself.

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 3:10 am
by kokino kolo
The Athenian politician-orator Demosthenes, King PhilipGÇÖs main opponent, speaking to the Athenians, said: GÇ£GǪarenGÇÖt all our powerful locations placed in the hands of this man? Will we not suffer the most awful humiliation? Are we not already at war with him? IsnGÇÖt he our enemy? IsnGÇÖt he in possession of our lands? IsnGÇÖt he a barbarian? DoesnGÇÖt he deserve all this name-calling?GÇ¥Demosthenes, in his speech, spoke with human anger against an opponent. When he called King Philip GÇ£barbarianGÇ¥, he did not mean that Philip was GÇ£not GreekGÇ¥. This was taken for granted, since in his Olynthian II oration, Demosthenes praises the State of Macedonia. At the same time Demosthenes could not call anyone a GÇ£barbarianGÇ¥, given that his own origin was GÇ£barbarianGÇ¥. Aeschinus, in his oration against Ktisiphon, calls Demosthenes GÇ£libelousGÇ¥, because he is GÇ£barbarianGÇ¥ by his Scythe mother and only a GÇ£GreekGÇ¥ by language.

Here is the Arrian Quote to discuss

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 11:24 am
by bob
Thanks for the reply!
[Book II - Battle of Issus] "Darius' Greeks fought to thrust the Macedonians back into the water and save the day for their left wing, already in retreat, while the Macedonians, in their turn, with Alexander's triumph plain before their eyes, were determined to equal his success and not forfeit the proud title of invincible, hitherto universally bestowed upon them. The fight was further embittered by the old racial rivalry of Greek and Macedonian." [p.119] Arrian Ancient Greek Historian The Campaigns of Alexander

Olypic games and Macedonians

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 11:26 am
by bob
I read somewhere that the Macedonians originally were not allowed in the Olympic games. Is this correct? (Sorry, can't remember where I read this.)
Bob