The Greek / Macedonian debate is outside the scope of this f

[susan]

Happy new year to everyone on the forum, and just a quick note - the Greek / Macedonian debate is out-of-bounds on the forum, and has been since the forum started. Everyone who has seen how the arguments often develop will understand why ; and while there are very interesting and balanced views on both sides, that would be very rewarding for us all to discuss, they often end up in negative emotions.So, can everyone please remember this when you post on Greek/Macedonian subjects.RegardsSusan

[stavros]

hello this message is regarded to all and i dont mean to offend anyone. however,as a greek, reading some of the stuff written on our macedonia is pathetic, absurd and completely off track. i dont understand when people say there is evidence on both sides that are interesting? wrong. when somehting is sooooo OBVIOUS, there should be a clear distinction between modern day fyromia and the ancient greeks. no correlation what so ever.the fyrom visitors on this website from what i read dont know anything about ancient greece. twisted tales to suit. and have yet to provide a source in their slavic dialect. its all greek. get over it.kind regards, stavros

[beausefaless]

Hear, hear!

[THE LIGHT 7000]

Yassu file Stavros- Stavraki,Happy new year,... yes yes I know, too much ouzo, and maybe few glasses of RETZINA -pine smelling white wine, yes yes I know that Greece have no good wines, it is Makedonian tradition,...get sobber now with few strong Turkish coffee's, good on you !... Did you know that most people seems more clever when they do not talk,well maybe is true who knows!...By the way, I will tell you somthing but do not tell anyone-OK. Yes is about Alexander. Do you know that Alexander went north of Danube river reaching even Skandinavia! Later, he come back with some soldiers from there. Yes, Vikings even made boaths for him... Many of those in Hymalaya were maybe from there too, so the capital of Hunza is Baltit, maybe Baltik... Who knows, better stop here and let others to dig bit further, OK my friend!?All the best
The Light 7000

[stavros]

Hello Vaskohappy new year to you and all the best for 2004. retsina is good. ouzo on the rocks is great before dinner, great apertizer. you should try it. however i think you have had too many shots of rakia. hehe.:)kind regardsstavrosV. i think alexander also visited Australia followed by New Zealand, just after his father died. he taught the Aboriginies how to hunt for kangaroo.

[ruthaki]

The Macedonians were notorious drinkers. Heheh...

[gb]

I think I need one (or two)...

[davej]

Funny you should say that , I found some Macedonian coins in my back yard when digging up my garden here in Sydney, so you must be right. As for New Zealand he may have been there too, there are no large terestial animals there anymore so maybe he and his army ate them all.

[dean]

Hi,I think that this thread is a perfect example to make your point Susan.Best
Dean

[THE LIGHT 7000]

Insert:...To stop various Gǣsudden jumpsGǥ over nothing, I will say only this, at present Greece is lifting embargo and is allowing all those expelled from Makedonia- Aegean part of Makedonia, Nth. Of Mt. Olymp, even those politically expelled and those on GǣBLACK LISTSGǥ (yes, there were black lists for people who used to work for Makedonian national movement and human rights, and who was just proclaiming to be Makedonians, GǪ), to go back to our motherland- Makedonia, to their homes from
where they were expelled as a children with their families or alone by than Greeks, who apparently were following political motivated strategy which is proved to be wrong (maybe hundreds of thousands innocent children were expelled in exile after WW II around the globe, especially in Poland, i.e. Eastern Europe, Canada, AustraliaGǪ). I am saying this now, with hope and wish, believe, that all those arguments will soften (but I think that some sort of constructive well ballanced debate- argument must be present in constructive dialogue for progres and mutual benefit for all), and slowly will go in our past, opening the future for better understanding each other with mutual respect and friendship, i.e. love, so we could enter new and better world togetherGǪMAY PEACE PREVAIL ON EARTH FOREVER
WITH ALL MY LOVE TRUTH & LIGHT-
THE LIGHT 7000

[yiannis]

Since Vasco goes now to the details of the Greek civil war (1945-1949) I better make some clarifications to his inaccurate (as usual) posting:1. The embargo on FYROM was lifted in 1995, not today, after FYROM accepted to change its flag and parts of its constitution to stress that it has no claims on Greek territory.
2. The people that were on the black lists were indeed a shame on Greece. When the Communists were defeated at the end of the civil war, in 1949, many rebels fled to the communist countries. Those were considered to be traitors and were stripped of the Greek citizenship. They were gradually granted amnesty in the decades that followed. The last 3000 of them were living in FYROM and were granted back their rights a few months ago. Many other people (mostly innocent of all crimes apart from their political believes were sent to "rehabilitation camps" in Aegean island and suffered greatly.
3. The children and families of prominent communists were send away to Communist countries, already during the war, by their parents, to avoid reprisals by the far-right government and the paramilitaries that were supported by the US and UK.

[the light 7000]

Yassu Yiannis, long time no hear you,.. Acctually I did not miss anything my friend, almost nothing has changed. ... But you should tell people that those people who were expelled from Greece on political ground, (in so called Greek civil war, acctually ethnic cleansing of Nth. Greece- Aegean Makedonia), were Makedonians and Greeks too, and they were liberators of Greece my friend, so you are real discgrace of your own people. Secondly, how one can be traitor when he is only five, yes 05-years old children expeled from home, put on train and deported who knows where in cold night with tears and cry... alone , how those children could be traitors,...shame on you...However, in the spirit of Makedonian Christmass, 07-January, we hope that angryness and hate i.e. evil, will start to fade and will disapiar in human hearts and souls,...so my friend, Marry Christmass to you and the rest of you...Let's wait and see, have patients, faith, love, compassion, respect...
it is worth and liberating- enlighting,May God Bless you all,
May Peace Prevail on Eart with Good Will among People, with all my Love truth and Light
The Light 7000

[stavros]

Vasko, kakousi.there is no hate, that is the worst word you could use. there is no reason for hate. i am assuming you are talking about 'hate' between greece and fyrom. you are wrong. historically greece has done nothing but aid its neighbour. what we disagree on (no hate involved) is the link between the ancient greeks & fyrom, and of course we all get worked up about it. from my perspective, what you think and what i think on the ancient greeks & fyrom will never be resolved, unfortunately. we are disagreeing pissed off neighbours. Merry Christmas.Stavros

[stavros]

maybe the greeks buried those coins in your backyard when they first migrated to Australia in 1829. probably stolen from greece. you never know. way after alex. hehe