How Alexander the Great Conquered Persia

[luisfc1972]

oh christ, give up already jona. im with kenny on this one, not wasting anymore posts on you.

[a spiropoulos]

its good to see how many respones there were, but lets not lose sight of the question ,sometimes we respond to other responses answers instead of the question.
alexander did what he was preordained too do in daniels prophesy.
its clear as the jews raced across the desert in their war against the arab league, they carried their torra,alexander had equivalent of this in his helmet,the blue stones of joshua,inscribed lord of hosts.
god uses peoples courage, others their fear, and events to bring about his prophies.
there could have not been any other outcome in these wars, he made alexander fearless against unsurmontable odds,gave him a miltary genius mind,
and together with his belief in daniels prophesy, inspired him to victory after victory.
and so was the prophesy forefilled.
as

[luisfc1972]

angelo its great to see the religious point of view. the bottom line in this thread though is people like jona fail miserably in their quest to belittle the great macedonian. this person tries so hard to make us believe what she sais. i feel sorry for people like that. they have such hate (in this case jona does not like alexander obviously) and they struggle to make sense out of their non-sense and make us believe it. keep trying jona maybe some ignorant mind will believe your poison. youre always reaching. i am still betting she is hiding something from us (love for persia, hate for alexander). perhaps a persian relative? who knows.

[marcus]

Well, disrespect is obviously in the eye of the beholder, because I can't see how saying "Persia was ripe for the plucking" is disrespectful.

[marcus]

Well, with all due respect, Luis, that's immensely childish.All the bestMarcus

[marcus]

Hi Chris,Well, it's a shame that such a good question has deteriorated into such a petty thread. Perhaps the whole thing needs to be deleted and started again.I hope you've gleaned *some* sort of answer to your question out of this!All the bestMarcus

[kenny]

cHRIS hAIL Chris im with you all the way on that one,, Alexander didnt have it easy from the off he had to quell large northern rebelions and uprising of Thebes and Athens.The Greeks were always divided is why the Romans so easily swallowed them up,,, Id say Alexanders so called Greek allies were less trustworthy than some of the Persian buddies,,, Alexander had to take Athenian hostages, Antipater was dealing witrh Persian bribery and corruption and Agis misbehaving.As its said Persia did have civil wars but when our boy arrived they were still calling the shots had huge power wealth and influence,,, Not the wounded handicapped puppy as has been said.
Our bor brought the Persian giant down fair and square with,planning fortitude brilliance and pure speed of action.Kenny

[abm]

Hi Tre,i don't think one can doubt whether Jona's view is balanced: he gives both the good and the negative aspects their due attention, thus it is balanced. Of course one argue whether his assessment on what was good and what was not is correct.Kenny and Luis,I don't think Jona is the bitter person here. As he said, the task of modern historical research is to reconstruct the past as good as possible. The only way to do so is to look at all the evidence and from as many angles as possible and that is what he does. He's book has the merit of equally incorporating the Greek (and Roman) sources as well as the Persian sources, and it is almost the only book that does so. Consequently his book is a lot richer than many others. For instance his analysis of Gaugamela is far better and more balanced than those of Cartledge and Worthinton, to name just two other recent books. If you refuse to read Jona's book, which is very interesting (whether you agree with everything or not), i think you simply do not want to understand what really happened in the age of Alexander. Whether you admire Alexander or not is absolutely not relevant here. Moreover, I don't think anyone on this forum will deny that Alexander was great, but that doesn't mean he was perfect (or almost).regards,abm

[marcus]

Hi Alexander - there is an additional problem, of course, that Jona's book is not available in English, and for many of us there's no chance of reading it in Dutch! I know some have said that they don't want to read it ... I'd *love* to read it, but there's no way I could without an English translation.Marcus

[marcus]

Kenny,That's a very good point about the situation in Greece. Certainly the turmoil in 336/335 was a great threat to Alexander's establishment of power, and his speed and efficiency in sorting things out were incredible.After starting the invasion, it could be argued that he all but forgot about Greece, being content to allow Antipater to deal with things - which shows a huge level of trust in Antipater. What he would have done had Agis defeated Antipater I don't know - possibly by that time he would have left Greece alone for a while, then returned to deal with them; but that's just speculation.Although I agree with Jona's 'overview' of Persia at the time, I think it would be a mistake to think of Persia as being a wounded puppy, just waiting to be put out of its misery. To be fair, I don't think that was ever seriously suggested.I still think, incidentally, that we haven't really addressed the original question - how did Alexander manage to conquer the empire so *quickly*. Through a mixture of Alexander's genius, ability to exploit a situation, military superiority, and Persia's recent troubles, we can understand how he managed it ... how he managed it in such a relatively short time is still open to debate, I think!All the bestMarcus

[xxx]

Hi Alexander:Agreeing with Marcus, I would need a translation to read Jona's book. My comments on balanced are based on what Jona has said on the Forum. Bosworth, Badian et al are no closer to being balanced than Tarn.Regards,Tre

[jona]

"I still think, incidentally, that we haven't really addressed the original question - how did Alexander manage to conquer the empire so *quickly*."Everything is always open to debate, but I guess this is a comparatively simple question. The Persian empire was, unlike the Parthian empire, quite centralized. Once the king was dead and the capital sacked, there was no other center of power; Bessus never received much support. More or less the same happened in 711, when the Arabs invaded Visigothic Spain. Once king Roderic was dead and Toledo captured, there was no Gothic leader that could resume the war.Jona

[Kit]

Hi Tre,I agree with you about the balanced viewpoints. What is your view on Green's 'Alexander of Macedon'? I have always prefered this as a more 'balanced' approach to the subject than the Hammond/Tarn, or Bosworth/Badian schools!Kit

[Kit]

Jona,I fully agree with your assessment as to the speed of Alexander's success. Alexander was well aware that the quickest way to victory was to cut off the 'head'. Darius had to be eliminated and the empire taken over relatively intact.His whole approach of seeking set piece battles was to achieve this aim. This direct approach in war is risky, as it usually involves defeating the enemy at their strongest point (i.e the whole Persian field army), however, as with all such high risk ventures it yields the greatest rewards.Or as Mr Stone put it- 'fortune favours the bold' !Kit.

[kenny]

Marcus HailI think he did it relatively fast because Alexander was dynamic and fast by nature,, He didnt mess about with politics rhetoric he went there to take Persia and went for it like a dead hungry boxer straight out for the kill,, A more seasoned boxer relies on tact and giule to wear down his aponent before going for the ko/ Alexander was a fresh boxer and went straight for the jugular very much like Tyson in his early dsays head down and in.But at the same time he never took his eye of the ball his suplies and his strategy especially his subdugation of Asia Minow which was a master stroke in any periods of war,,, To neutralise what he felt was his only threat from behind the Persian sea power.Alexander got the Persians on the ropes and never let go.
regards
kenny