Why did Alexander spare the house of Pindar at Thebes?

[Basileus]

Do we have anything else other than that he liked his poetry?

[marcus]

Do we have anything else other than that he liked his poetry?

Basically, no. However, I think it was much more than that Alexander "liked" his poetry - Pindar was considered one of the "greats" of Greek art, and in Aelian, Dio Chrysostom and Pliny (below) mention of the saving of Pindar's house directly follows a description of Alexander's reverence for Homer.

And it is "reverence" here, rather than just "like" (I assume you were being a bit flippant, anyway).

For what it's worth, these are the only references to the sparing of Pindar's house (that I am aware of - if anyone has any others, then please do let me know!).

Arrian 1.9.10
[10] They say that Alexander saved the poet Pindar’s house and any of his descendants out of reverence for Pindar.

Plutarch, Alexander 11.6
[6] So after separating out the priests, all who were guest-friends of the Macedonians, the descendants of Pindar, and those who had voted against the revolt, he sold the rest into slavery,

Aelian 13.7
When Alexander captured Thebes, he sold into slavery all free citizens except priests. He also exempted from sale his father’s hosts – Philip as a boy had been a hostage there – and released their relatives. He paid honour to the descendants of Pindar, and allowed his house alone to stand. He executed about 6,000 Thebans, and 30,000 were taken prisoner.

Dio Chrysostom, 2.33
[33] Stesichorus and Pindar, the former because he was looked upon as an imitator of Homer and composed a “Capture of Troy,” a creditable work, and Pindar because of the brilliancy of his genius and the fact that he had extolled the ancestor whose name he bore: Alexander, nicknamed the Philhellene, to whom the poet alluded in the verse

“Namesake of the blest sons of Dardanus.”

This is the reason why, when later he sacked Thebes, he left only that poet’s house standing, directing that this notice be posted upon it:

“Set not on fire the roof of Pindar, maker of song.”
Undoubtedly he was most grateful to those who eulogized him worthily, when he was so particular as this in seeking renown.

Pliny, 7.109
It was the same conqueror, too, who gave directions that the descendants and house of the poet Pindar(2) should be spared at the taking of Thebes.

Suda (P 1619)
They say that Alexander razed Thebes to the ground and, sparing only priests and priestesses, enslaved the rest; and they say that he protected the house of the poet Pindar and the descendants of Pindar from harm, out of reverence for Pindar - so says Arrian the historian in book 1 of his Anabasis of Alexander.

All the best

[amyntoros]

Not a reference to the sparing of Pindar's house, but he did also write a poem dedicated to Ammon which Ptolemy carved on a slab by the altar to Ammon in Thebes.

Pausanias 9.16.1 [Boeotia] Thebes:
[XVI] …Not far away is a temple of Ammon; the image, a work of Calamis, was dedicated by Pindar, who also sent to the Ammonians of Libya a hymn to Ammon. This hymn I found still carved on a triangular slab by the side of the altar dedicated to Ammon by Ptolemy the son of Lagus. After the sanctuary of Ammon at Thebes comes what is called the bird-observatory of Teiresias, and near it is a sanctuary of Fortune, who carries the child Wealth.

Given that there was a temple to Ammon in Macedonia at Aphytis (and we all know about Alexander's need to visit the temple in Siwah) it seems possible, if not likely, that this too might have been a reason for Alexander sparing Pindar's house.

Best regards,

[marcus]

Not a reference to the sparing of Pindar's house, but he did also write a poem dedicated to Ammon which Ptolemy carved on a slab by the altar to Ammon in Thebes.

Pausanias 9.16.1 [Boeotia] Thebes:
[XVI] …Not far away is a temple of Ammon; the image, a work of Calamis, was dedicated by Pindar, who also sent to the Ammonians of Libya a hymn to Ammon. This hymn I found still carved on a triangular slab by the side of the altar dedicated to Ammon by Ptolemy the son of Lagus. After the sanctuary of Ammon at Thebes comes what is called the bird-observatory of Teiresias, and near it is a sanctuary of Fortune, who carries the child Wealth.

Given that there was a temple to Ammon in Macedonia at Aphytis (and we all know about Alexander's need to visit the temple in Siwah) it seems possible, if not likely, that this too might have been a reason for Alexander sparing Pindar's house.

Best regards,

True. It all rather depends on when Alexander began to accord so much honour to Ammon. We know, of course, that Ammon was not exactly an unknown cult, and as you say there was a temple to Ammon in Macedonia. The question is whether this meant as much to Alexander in 335BC as it did in 331BC, and therefore whether he just revered Pindar as a poet, or whether he revered him as a poet who had written a particular hymn to Ammon?

An interesting question, indeed!

(BTW - note the use I'm getting from the Concordance! )

ATB

[spitamenes]

Marcus,
Where did you find the "concordance" you have been using? Seems pretty handy.

[amyntoros]

True. It all rather depends on when Alexander began to accord so much honour to Ammon. We know, of course, that Ammon was not exactly an unknown cult, and as you say there was a temple to Ammon in Macedonia. The question is whether this meant as much to Alexander in 335BC as it did in 331BC, and therefore whether he just revered Pindar as a poet, or whether he revered him as a poet who had written a particular hymn to Ammon?

Good question. livius.org has this to say:

Some 400 kilometers to the west lay the Siwa oasis, which was famous for its oracle of Ammon, a god whose cult had been propagated in Greece by the poet Pindar. He had been the first Greek to dedicate an ode to the god and one of the first to erect a statue to the god. Alexander must have known the shrine of Zeus Ammon in the Macedonian town Aphytis, and it is perhaps not too far-fetched to assume that Alexander spared the house of Pindar (above) because of the statue. On the other hand, there is no evidence that Alexander worshipped the ram-god before he visited Siwa in March 331.

Although livius.org says above that Pindar "propagated" the cult in Greece, on another page it says that he "was responsible for the introduction of a new god in Greece: Zeus Ammon." (No source references, unfortunately.) If this is true - and I see no reason to doubt it - then I'm leaning towards thinking that it did add to Alexander's reasons for sparing his house, whether or not A was already "interested" in Ammon. We know how much attention he paid to religious matters.

(BTW - note the use I'm getting from the Concordance! )

I have noted this! Must make you feel good about all the time and work involved, although I'll let you give more details to Spitamenes.

Best regards,

[marcus]

Marcus,
Where did you find the "concordance" you have been using? Seems pretty handy.

This is the moment where I blow my own trumpet. I have spent a considerable amount of time and effort (with a large amount of background work from Amyntoros) putting together a concordance of Alexander historians, which gives me chapter and verse on where one will find all the events of Alexander's life and career in all the ancient sources (up to and including the 10th century Suda). There's no doubt that there must be a lot that's missing, but one has to set some limitations and parameters on such a thing - but, no doubt also, it will continue to grow.

But it did mean that, when you asked the question, it was very quick for me to open up the concordance and find all the references to Alexander's sparing of Pindar's house ... and it took a little longer to open up the sources and copy and paste the text into my post. Obviously it helped that I had all the sources sitting on my PC in electronic format!

ATB

[spitamenes]

That's pretty cool stuff Marcus. Something like that would really come in handy for quick references! Slap a barcode on it and sell em like hotcakes! Id buy it!

P.s. I moved up in rank! I am now a companion! This merits a trip to the pub! Although I would have ended up there anyway.

[marcus]

That's pretty cool stuff Marcus. Something like that would really come in handy for quick references! Slap a barcode on it and sell em like hotcakes! Id buy it!

P.s. I moved up in rank! I am now a companion! This merits a trip to the pub! Although I would have ended up there anyway.

I'm certainly glad you like the concept, Spitamenes. I am certainly thinking about publication, even to a limited audience. Before I get to that point there will be some more work to do, however, as I feel I need to add some editorial comments. It's certainly not intended as a historiographical critique of the sources - it's basically "this is where you'll find references", but some editorial comments will be necessary, I think.

Have I got your email address? Send me a PM to remind me, and I'll email you a sample so you can see how the thing works.

(And, BTW, any other Pothosians who would like to see a sample of the concordance, send me your emails by PM and I'll lob it over - might as well gauge the level of interest amongst this interest group!)

ATB

[jan]

Hello Marcus,

This post has certainly surprised me. I am interested in your concordance if you simply want an interest gauge, but I find that I cannot send a pm and have no idea why. I did go to the faq to see what it says...I would like to know why I cannot send a private message. I see that this discussion group has changed a lot from earlier times. After my book is released, I may realize why someone might object to its content, but so far only a few are aware of its existence at all. I have decided to be both blunt and forthright in some of it so that that may end up putting me on everybody's foe list here. I see that there is a friend and foe list also now.

What is that? and why?

When I first joined this discussion group, a member here told me that this is a place for authors to gather...Jan Oh, I can be reached at Jan_Neptune@yahoo.com where I continue to moderate Alexander-Macedon with three other members.

[marcus]

Hello Marcus,

This post has certainly surprised me. I am interested in your concordance if you simply want an interest gauge, but I find that I cannot send a pm and have no idea why. I did go to the faq to see what it says...I would like to know why I cannot send a private message. I see that this discussion group has changed a lot from earlier times. After my book is released, I may realize why someone might object to its content, but so far only a few are aware of its existence at all. I have decided to be both blunt and forthright in some of it so that that may end up putting me on everybody's foe list here. I see that there is a friend and foe list also now.

What is that? and why?

Jan, I wouldn't worry about "friend and foe" lists - the whole point about Pothos is that people should feel able to disagree with one another. It would be very boring otherwise. Occasionally things get a little heated, but everyone remains friends, truly. You've been part of Pothos for long enough to know that's how it's always been, surely?

With regard to sending private messages, you just have to click the icon on the right hand side of the screen, underneath the details of the person to whom you wish to send it. Here's a picture:

How to send a private message

How to send a private message.JPG (19.8 KiB) Viewed 11521 times

Hope this helps.

ATB

[jan]

Thanks, Marcus If only I had looked! I am getting a chuckle out of this now...Thanks for the graphics...I needed that!

[marcus]

Thanks, Marcus If only I had looked! I am getting a chuckle out of this now...Thanks for the graphics...I needed that!

My pleasure!

PM sent back to you, plus an email with a sample of the concordance.

ATB

[LeGrandAriel]

Pindar made a poem to praise Alexander I of Macedonia when he travelled there.That's why his house was spared.

[LeGrandAriel]

Pindar made a poem to praise Alexander I of Macedonia when he travelled there.That's why his house was spared.