They can now identify ancient diseases

[karen]

Hi all -- especially Andrew Chugg!You're probably already aware of this, but just in case you aren't: Kathimerini via rogueclassicism has a fascinating piece about how scientists have used new techniques to identify the nature of the plague that struck Athens 430-426 BCE. By examining mummified microbial DNA in the lab they've determined that the disease was typhoid fever. http://www.atrium-media.com/rogueclassi ... 02820.html .So if Alexander's remains were found, a definitive answer to the mystery of which disease, if it was a disease, killed him might be possible...!Karen

[Paralus]

G'day Karen.Abso-bloody-lutely fascinating!It's long been conjectured that the Athenian Plague was typhoid. As the article explains, the fly in the ointment was that the symptoms were not absolutely the same as the modern manifestation. Self evidently, the pathogen evolves (as do they all).I doubt we will ever find Alexander's body GÇô I think it disappeared in antiquity. Well, late antiquity at any rate.Imagine the course of the "Athenian War" (as the Spartans will have termed it) sans those terrible losses. Amazing actually, after the devastation of the plague, that Athens was in a position to launch the armada it did against Sicily.

Even more amazing, after the annihilation of that armada, that Athens fought on and was in a position to lose some 170 out of 180 triremes at Aegespotami!One can't help but wonder why the Spartans didn't do what Philip did some seventy years later: take a stranglehold on Athens' gonads GÇô the Hellespont. That always begot an instant result.Again the question niggles at me: why march into central Greece to meet Philip in 338 instead of man 180 triremes and sail into the Thermaic Gulf??
Paralus.

[Paralus]

G'day Karen.Abso-bloody-lutely fascinating!It's long been conjectured that the Athenian Plague was typhoid. As the article explains, the fly in the ointment was that the symptoms were not absolutely the same as the modern manifestation. Self evidently, the pathogen evolves (as do they all).I doubt we will ever find Alexander's body GÇô I think it disappeared in antiquity. Well, late antiquity at any rate.Imagine the course of the "Athenian War" (as the Spartans will have termed it) sans those terrible losses. Amazing actually, after the devastation of the plague, that Athens was in a position to launch the armada it did against Sicily.

Even more amazing, after the annihilation of that armada, that Athens fought on and was in a position to lose some 170 out of 180 triremes at Aegespotami!One can't help but wonder why the Spartans didn't do what Philip did some seventy years later: take a stranglehold on Athens' gonads GÇô the Hellespont. That always begot an instant result.Again the question niggles at me: why march into central Greece to meet Philip in 338 instead of man 180 triremes and sail into the Thermaic Gulf??
Paralus.

[kate]

I read about this new discovery in the "Times" last week and immediately thought wow! It just seems incredible that we can gain such detailed knowledge about events so long past. By chance on the same evening after reading the article there was a TV programme on about two bodies found in peat bogs in Ireland . They turned out to be more or less contemporary with Alexander and the specialists carrying out the examinations were able to find out all sorts of details even though both the bodies were incomplete. They found out how they were killed and even things like one of the men was really short, about five feet two inches, and he used an imported hair gum to dress his hair high so he'd look taller! Imagine what they could find about about Alexander if his body ever did turn up - not that I think it will, I suspect it disappeared in antiquity unfortunately.Cheers,
Kate

[kate]

I read about this new discovery in the "Times" last week and immediately thought wow! It just seems incredible that we can gain such detailed knowledge about events so long past. By chance on the same evening after reading the article there was a TV programme on about two bodies found in peat bogs in Ireland . They turned out to be more or less contemporary with Alexander and the specialists carrying out the examinations were able to find out all sorts of details even though both the bodies were incomplete. They found out how they were killed and even things like one of the men was really short, about five feet two inches, and he used an imported hair gum to dress his hair high so he'd look taller! Imagine what they could find about about Alexander if his body ever did turn up - not that I think it will, I suspect it disappeared in antiquity unfortunately.Cheers,
Kate

[Athanasios]

Karen,This is indeed an historic find! Not only does it shed light on the events that caused so many death, but it brings history to life and us a little a closer to the past...Regards,
Atha

[Athanasios]

Karen,This is indeed an historic find! Not only does it shed light on the events that caused so many death, but it brings history to life and us a little a closer to the past...Regards,
Atha

[Taphoi]

Hi Karen,Yes, testing ancient remains for microbial DNA is now a standard technique in forensic archaeology. Even more relevant to Alexander's fate (imho) is its application to show death by malaria for Roman bodies - see for example: http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/ancient/ro ... _01.shtmlI discuss various tests (including DNA tests) that could be performed on remains to check whether they were Alexander's in the "St Mark Testing Proposal", which I posted at http://www.alexanderstomb.com/ at Xmas.Basically, the tests are so powerful and sensitive nowadays, that it would normally be easy to reach a definitive conclusion.Btw, there is no evidence that Alexander's remains were ever destroyed, so to believe them forever lost is simply a leap of faith.Best wishes,Andrew

[Taphoi]

Hi Karen,Yes, testing ancient remains for microbial DNA is now a standard technique in forensic archaeology. Even more relevant to Alexander's fate (imho) is its application to show death by malaria for Roman bodies - see for example: http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/ancient/ro ... _01.shtmlI discuss various tests (including DNA tests) that could be performed on remains to check whether they were Alexander's in the "St Mark Testing Proposal", which I posted at http://www.alexanderstomb.com/ at Xmas.Basically, the tests are so powerful and sensitive nowadays, that it would normally be easy to reach a definitive conclusion.Btw, there is no evidence that Alexander's remains were ever destroyed, so to believe them forever lost is simply a leap of faith.Best wishes,Andrew