Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Discuss the culture of Alexander's world and his image in art

Moderator: pothos moderators

system1988
Hetairos (companion)
Posts: 739
Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2011 11:20 am
Location: Athens, Greece

Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by system1988 »



…ἐν δ᾽ ἐτίθει μέλιτος καὶ ἀλείφατος ἀμφιφορῆας πρὸς λέχεα κλίνων: πίσυρας δ᾽ ἐριαύχενας ἵππους ἐσσυμένως ἐνέβαλλε πυρῇ μεγάλα στεναχίζων…

…And thereon he set two-handled jars of honey and oil, leaning them against the bier; and four horses with high arched neeks he cast swiftly upon the pyre, groaning aloud the while...

Iliad, Rapsody Ψ (23rd), lines 170 -171 – The burial of Patroklos



Did you ever wonder, when you saw in movies, how Alexander and his cavalry always seemed to have no trouble to guide and control their steeds, even during the battle? How did they do it? There were no stirrups at the time...

I am sending to you a link with some photos of the harness found in grave II in Vergina (Philip 2nd or a royal relative of his), In the chamber, near the marble sarcofagus that contained the golden urn and the deceased's weapons; bits, partrs of bridles, and 2 bronze spurs as well as the remains of 4 horses were found.

http://s1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg6 ... 20Vergina/

As far as the spurs are concerned, they were used by the Greeks since the 5th BC. From Xenophon's words in "On Horssmanship, VIII,5" we know that the spurs were vital for a rider. The spurs found in Vergina has a distinct difference compared to the other ones found. The two brachions (curved parts) are not free enough to allow the heel to externally be placed on them and the part that stung the horse is not that sharp as we would think. The Vergina spurs were held by the sole of the shoe and not by the heel part of the shoe. They might very well have been very tightly attached to the shoe. This is proved by the mechanism's internal side which is smooth. In contrast to that, the external part is suitably formed for the three pointy ends to touch the ground. In that way the spur weaponized the shoe itsef. The rest of the shoe's soel would be covered with big nails. This would of course mean that the spurs were forever bound to the pair of shoes, placed with the deceased warrior's clothes (the dead one must have been very rich to have such special shoes for horse riding.)

The No. 30 figure shows how the spur was attached to the shoe.

The number of bridles found in Vergina shows that in the funeral pyre 4 horses were burned along with their bridles and spurs. They were young, so perfect for battle. Horse sacrificies in honor of their owners are known to us from Homer (see above) as well as from other excavations from the site of Marathon (Mycenenan Era). The Vergina findings prove that an old custom, known to the Greeks since the Mycenean Era survived till the 4th BC (like the golden funeral masks that -from Mycenae - we find them also being used in Macedonia until the Archaic Times (See Arhondikon for more info). The fact that the harness was found leads us to the conclusion that the horses must have been pulling a chariot. Perhaps the chariot itself was burnt along with the horses during the funeral pyre.

The information came from "ΑΔ 41 P. Faklaris "Harnesses from Vergina" (this is a rough sinopsis)

The scientific community is divided on whether the deceased is Philip II or not. If the first is true, Alexander himself handled his father's funeral; he may had had in his mind Homer's words during Patroklo's funeral and the four horses that Achilles sacrificed for him. This may be a romantic view of the situation but always a strong possibility.
Πάντες άνθρωποι του ειδέναι ορέγονται φύσει
agesilaos
Strategos (general)
Posts: 2180
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 3:16 pm
Location: LONDON

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by agesilaos »

Horses respond to pressure from the riders knees which does not require stirrups, as well as the goads of spur and bridle. The Numidians and red Indians dispensed with both and were accounted the best light cavalry of their era. As with so much, it is training and empathy with the mount that really count (ooh err might sound sexist :oops: )
Last edited by agesilaos on Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
When you think about, it free-choice is the only possible option.
system1988
Hetairos (companion)
Posts: 739
Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2011 11:20 am
Location: Athens, Greece

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by system1988 »

agesilaos wrote:Horses respond to pressure from the riders knees which does not require stirrups, as well as the goads of spur and bridle. The Numidians and red Indians dispensed with both and were accounted the best light cavalry of their era. As with so much, it is training and empathy with the mount that really count (ooh err might sound sexist :oops: )

Should be a link

http://www.archive.org/stream/cu3192402 ... 3/mode/2up

I believe that a horse would need more than just empathy and knee pressure during a battle (an elephant frontal assault would render any battle horse uncontrollable without the aid of spurs or bridles)

Should we then hypothgesize that all the harnesses that we have found over the years were used as bracelets or necklases?
Πάντες άνθρωποι του ειδέναι ορέγονται φύσει
User avatar
marcus
Somatophylax
Posts: 4785
Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2002 7:27 am
Location: Nottingham, England

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by marcus »

system1988 wrote:I believe that a horse would need more than just empathy and knee pressure during a battle (an elephant frontal assault would render any battle horse uncontrollable without the aid of spurs or bridles)

Should we then hypothgesize that all the harnesses that we have found over the years were used as bracelets or necklases?
I do agree that there would be a problem when horses go up against elephants. Yes, it does require more than empathy and knee pressure. However, it is also important to note that the bridlery in your photos includes snaffle bits, which allow for more control (as well as less damage to the horse's mouth), and that should not be forgotten!

Edited to add: I should say that it *appears* to include snaffle bits. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snaffle_bit

ATB
Marcus
Sine doctrina vita est quasi mortis imago
At Amazon US
At Amazon UK
agesilaos
Strategos (general)
Posts: 2180
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 3:16 pm
Location: LONDON

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by agesilaos »

System you seem confused about what I was saying, which is not surprising as I posted a link to Dionysios of Halikarnassos which belongs on the 'Ugly' thread! Doh!

I would not seek to imply the Greeks lacked horse furniture, there are plenty of pictures on vases showing bridles, reins, blankets etc. But the Numidians represent the bare minimum of equipment and still made effective cavalry. I cannot think of a single instance where cavalry attacked elephants, it was the impossibility of doing so that sealed the fate of Antgonos at Ipsos.
When you think about, it free-choice is the only possible option.
sikander
Somatophylax
Posts: 309
Joined: Wed Aug 14, 2002 8:17 pm

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by sikander »

Greetings,
Good discussion.
As an equestrian, I would like to point out that, as indicated through mention of Indians and Numidians, non-bitted riding can be done with hakma (the inspiration for the modern bosals and hackamore), bosals, hackamores, cross-unders, cavessons/sidepulls, lip ropes, and such. The rider has as much control with these as he would have with a bitted animal when horse and rider are both properly trained. That said, I note that even ancient statues have holes drilled for what appears to be bits where horses are concerned, and bits were known at the time of Alexander. As suggested, both straight bar and jointed snaffles were probably common.
Spurs are a tool, but not a necessary tool even in warfare. While they enjoyed some popularity for a time, they are fast becoming more a thing for show than a necessity. Urging a horse to move forward even when it does not wish to move forward does not require the use of spurs.
I agree with the assessment that stirrups are not necessary. The rider's seat/balance, use of knee pressure, and such can guide even a galloping horse over rough terrain, and even in difficult situations, a horse that trusts its rider can be guided without the use of spurs or saddle and stirrups. I have ridden many hard miles on somewhat risky trails in mountainous areas using *no* tack (bareback) outside of a bitless bridle or hackamore.
So yes, it is possible to ride into battle without stirrups (though I noted in the Stone movie there were riding pads under the blankets <chuckle>)
Regards,
Sikander
robbie
Pezhetairos (foot soldier)
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 1:14 pm

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by robbie »

1. But the riders during Alexander's area, including himself, did use both bridles and bits, right?

2. How come they didn't use stirrups? Was it because they hadn't been invented yet? Didn't the Chinese use stirrups during the same period?



Regards Robert
agesilaos
Strategos (general)
Posts: 2180
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 3:16 pm
Location: LONDON

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by agesilaos »

Stirrups did nor reach the West until about the seventh century AD via Avar invaders; the earliest Eastern examples date to paintings in China of c.320 AD. Alexander's cavalry used bits and reins and bridles but lacked saddles, using only a saddle cloth. Which would be odd if the Companions used a couched xyston, impact would knock them off their mounts, we have to assume that the force of the thrust came from the rider's upper body; forces are considerably lower with this technique allowing a good grip with the thighs to maintain the rider's seat. The horses that Alexander's men rode were more like ponies which would make the grip easier (This is described in Xenophon's 'On Horsemanship').
When you think about, it free-choice is the only possible option.
Alexias
Strategos (general)
Posts: 1099
Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 11:16 am

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by Alexias »

The main reason the ancient Greeks didn't have saddles and stirrups was because the buckle hadn't been invented yet. I don't think they were invented until the late Roman era and even then they were just a military item. Saddles have to be fairly heavy to stay put on the horses' back and tying it onto a horse would not be secure enough under the stress of hard riding - it would be too prone to slippage and breaking. Even if saddles had been invented before the buckle (I don't think the Greeks were particularly good on leather craft), a buckle enables you to tighten the grith much more securely.

You could have stirrups without a saddle I suppose but they probably wouldn't be a lot of use and came after the invention of the saddle so that you could apply more pressure with the knees.

Because China never developed as a sea-faring and trading nation - it had no need to having a large land mass - many of its inventions (paper, gunpowder) did not reach Europe until post-Marco Polo's journeys in the 13th century.
robbie
Pezhetairos (foot soldier)
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 1:14 pm

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by robbie »

Thanks Agesilaos and Alexias

much obliged! :-)


But wait a minute, Alexander's cavalry didn't ride small horses now, did they? You mentioned something about their size being almost that of a pony?!
Have a hard time believing that...
agesilaos
Strategos (general)
Posts: 2180
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 3:16 pm
Location: LONDON

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by agesilaos »

The Greek horse as described by J.K. Anderson in Ancient Greek Horsemanship was not a large animal, probably averaging fifteen hands at the withers--just a few inches taller than the largest modern ponies.
Courtesy of http://www1.hollins.edu/faculty/salowey ... phalus.htm.
When you think about, it free-choice is the only possible option.
Alexias
Strategos (general)
Posts: 1099
Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 11:16 am

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by Alexias »

Arrian shows how comparatively small the horses were:

"But when at last the ford was found, he led his men through it with much difficulty; for where the water was deepest, it reached higher than the breasts of the infantry; and of the horses only the heads rose above the river."

Also, take a look at any contemporary frieze with horsemen and riders and you will see that the horses are no taller than the men.
agesilaos
Strategos (general)
Posts: 2180
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 3:16 pm
Location: LONDON

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by agesilaos »

I would encourage caution around artistic depictions; sometimes convention subourns reality...in this case, the Arrian is telling.

As a further point, or rather musing; later hellenistic horsemen were for the most part shielded javelin armed riders I wonder if an influx of better horse stock had caused the mounts to grow beyond the point where they could gain sufficient purchase for the efficient thrust of long spears; other mounted lancers among the ancients, like the Sarmatae and Parthians used a saddle. If this is a troubling notion I would ask to have a heavy lunch taken into considerstion :D
When you think about, it free-choice is the only possible option.
Alexias
Strategos (general)
Posts: 1099
Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 11:16 am

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by Alexias »

Very true :) It makes for a neat frieze if the horse's ears are level with the top of the man's head, but surely not too far off the truth?
later hellenistic horsemen were for the most part shielded javelin armed riders I wonder if an influx of better horse stock had caused the mounts to grow beyond the point where they could gain sufficient purchase for the efficient thrust of long spears; other mounted lancers among the ancients, like the Sarmatae and Parthians used a saddlle.
Interesting point. I wonder if the Celtic intrusion into Galatia might have brought a different horse strain into the region?
User avatar
Paralus
Chiliarch
Posts: 2875
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:13 am
Location: Sydney, Australia
Contact:

Re: Horseback riding in the Hellenistic Era

Post by Paralus »

Alexias wrote:Interesting point. I wonder if the Celtic intrusion into Galatia might have brought a different horse strain into the region?
More likely the invasion of the East saw a better infusion of "stud-stock". In the east mounted warriors were not only the elite but the most militarily important. Assyrian, Median and Persian warfare relied upon mounted warriors. It is logical (to channel Spock) that a better breed (almost without fail in warfare, "bigger") would be the result.
agesilaos wrote:... later hellenistic horsemen were for the most part shielded javelin armed riders I wonder if an influx of better horse stock had caused the mounts to grow beyond the point where they could gain sufficient purchase for the efficient thrust of long spears;
Your lunch has undone you. Later Hellenistic horsemen of the Greek mainland "were for the most part shielded javelin armed riders". How, and exactly when, this happened is a matter of argument. That it did is not. In the east - the Seleucid Empire for example - the "classic" Hellenistic "heavy" cavalry (think exactly Alexander's hetairoi - xystophoroi) continued unto Magnesia; this notwithstanding the adoption of cataphracts by Antiochus III after his "anabasis". Indeed, it was with these classic "Alexandrian"xystophoroi that he led the fateful charge at Raphia in 217 BC.
Paralus
Ἐπὶ τοὺς πατέρας, ὦ κακαὶ κεφαλαί, τοὺς μετὰ Φιλίππου καὶ Ἀλεξάνδρου τὰ ὅλα κατειργασμένους;
Wicked men, you sin against your fathers, who conquered the whole world under Philip and Alexander.

Academia.edu
Post Reply